Shipbucket

It's fun! But I might need a break from old timey stuff...my next "real design" will be a modern monitor with a laser gun!

http://www.confederate-flags.org/confed ... g%201.html
Bottom of the page, that's why I posted the site. This is a period flag made at the Richmond depot. I have seen it with my own eyes in Montgomery, where they have it now, and it is not the only example of such.


"This flag, which bears no War Department markings, is a third national Confederate flag which was manufactured at the Richmond Clothing Depot some time after March 4, 1865. The regimental designation, and date of capture or surrender are unknown"

It is believed that it belonged to the 5th Alabama Infantry and was surrendered at Appomattox; it was returned to Alabama by mistake in place of a set of colors that were captured in 1862... even while the war was going on, no one in the Union (and not many in the Confederacy) knew exactly what flag we were using at the time!

Well, Carthaginian, I can see your point, though I couldn't find the above reference. Maybe when I get home and read it more closely. However, my pint was validated though, namely that few if any flags of the Third Edition was ever sewn during that last, closing month of the war. I know for sure that none of the regiments that surrendered with Gen. Joseph E. Johnston at Bennett's Place on April 26, 1865 possessed that banner, and thus no sea-going vessels, for instance, could possibly have either!
However, your point about the inherent confusion about national flags, battle flags etc that reigned supreme within the confederacy is a most valid point!

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My Avatar:Петр Алексеевич Безобразов (Petr Alekseevich Bezobrazov), Вице-адмирал , царская ВМФ России(1845-1906) - I sign my drawings as Ari Saarinen

I would say you're correct Zephyr, she visited Williamstown, Melbourne, where the Victorian Colonial navy got a bit nervous about having a foreign warship in the port.

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Work list(Current)
Miscellaneous|Victorian Colonial Navy|Murray Riverboats|Colony of Victoria AU|Project Sail-fixing SB's sail shortage
How to mentally pronounce my usernameRow-(as in a boat)Don-(as in the short form of Donald)Dough-(bread)
"Loitering on the High Seas" (Named after the good ship Rodondo)
There's no such thing as "nothing left to draw" If you can down 10 pints and draw, you're doing alright by my standards

bezobrazov,

You're right about Shenandoah and her colors; I think that, as you pointed out, the proper vs improper usage of 'war flag' and the 'Stars and Bars' nickname caused a great deal of the misunderstanding here. This is a photograph (fortuitous!) of the lady in Melbourne, and she is indeed flying the Stainless Banner as her national flag.


Her naval jack was, though, of the same pattern as the Army of Tennessee's battle flag, and that was the issue I was addressing due to the misunderstanding. Apologies!!!

The only reason I posted the last example is that several units did indeed either receive sewn examples of the 3rd National Flag, or modify their 2nd National flags to conform to its description. The reference to the Klan is inaccurate, as the Klansmen were historically as likely to carry American flags as any other (especially from the post Span-Am war period till the 50's)... the trend of carrying Naval Jacks and calling them 'battle flags' is a more recent thing, owing largely to the Jim Crow era.

The story of the Shenandoah, regardless of which flag, is still an interesting one though.

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"Anybody remotely interesting is mad in some way." - The Seventh Doctor

What isn't shown in the picture that Carthagian poster is the "Elder" raft pointing her gun at the raider, I believe the wharf still exists though, heavily updated though

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Work list(Current)
Miscellaneous|Victorian Colonial Navy|Murray Riverboats|Colony of Victoria AU|Project Sail-fixing SB's sail shortage
How to mentally pronounce my usernameRow-(as in a boat)Don-(as in the short form of Donald)Dough-(bread)
"Loitering on the High Seas" (Named after the good ship Rodondo)
There's no such thing as "nothing left to draw" If you can down 10 pints and draw, you're doing alright by my standards

Well, the raiders were viewed as Privateers at best and Pirates at worst- by many, they were generally considered the latter. As Australia has absolutely ZERO real connection to the Confederacy... well, honestly, yeah- I can't say I blame them.

No probe, Cart. You're right about the issue of the KKK, though, only at a latter point, their so-called Second revival'. Now, im not a historian of that murky, reprehensible organization, but I know that, during their first period of activity, they did not wave any Union flags, unless the purpose was to pun blame on the Northerners and the Carpetbaggers. Bedford Forrest and his first Klan were fiercely and staunchly 'Rebels' and very much unreconstructed such.
As for the other thing, yes, a few flags of the third edition were issued, mostly, say 90% were redeem ones, issued after the reorganization of Gen. Johnston's motley army into the second Army of Tennessee, on March, 1865, a couple of days prior to the Battle of Bentonville, 18-20. March.
As for that army, I'm currently in the (loooong) process of writing a thesis, and to me, Johnston is a greater general that Lee... but that's a whole different issue...- btw, this is a very interesting discussion which I thoroughly enjoy, but I'm afraid we're taking up precious space from the ship drawings...

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My Avatar:Петр Алексеевич Безобразов (Petr Alekseevich Bezobrazov), Вице-адмирал , царская ВМФ России(1845-1906) - I sign my drawings as Ari Saarinen

If you get it bound/published, could you PM me with details?
I have a personal interest in the Army of Tennessee, as my mother's great-great-grandfather was under that organization prior to his initial capture and time as a POW. Anything touching upon it would be a good read for my uncle and myself, and I would be interested in obtaining a copy.

Now, back to the ships!!!