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CATZ
Post subject: Re: Advanced Battleship (BBN)Posted: June 21st, 2011, 8:46 pm
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We have no infrastructure for heavy naval artillery, nobody does.
It's for an AU.

But either way, establishing infrastructure for such a thing would be no different than establishing infrastructure for any other ship part. If you need it, you build it.
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The problem is you're assuming there will be high value targets in the future, which with the current warfare is a doubtful proposition.
I'm not assuming anything. Everything I used for design considerations came from the Colonel's thesis.
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You would need to have almost a hundred meters beam, possible but not a good idea.
Not at all. Where do you come up with these wild assumptions? Wouldn't even need half that.
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You don't have room behind the plates for many of your phased array radars.
Sure it does. I moved the arm launchers that Thiel noted could be an issue. Other than that, the arrays have a little more room for placement than a Burke does.
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Besides that, no reactor in the world would power that many expensive, delicate and heavy radars for very long.
Sure they could. That was discussed a couple pages ago. Takes about 14-15 MW. So about 2.5 times the radar capacity of a Burke (and it's power usage for said radars).
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Your turrets are geometrically impossible, regaurdless of where you took them from.
Again, you don't know what your talking about. There's nothing geometrically impossible about them.

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CATZ
Post subject: Re: Advanced Battleship (BBN)Posted: June 21st, 2011, 8:49 pm
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Why was the hull form rejected for CG(X)?


Yes, but tracking isn't the same as engaging.

And I didn't ignore it at all, it was just a pointless proposition since the entire cruiser was cancelled.

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CATZ
Post subject: Re: Advanced Battleship (BBN)Posted: June 21st, 2011, 8:51 pm
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Carnac wrote:
I'm not sure about using a game to prove a point. May I pull up Civilization 3, and watch as a spearman defeats a tank?
http://h3milsim.com/

http://www.computerharpoon.com/about-ag ... rpoon.html

That's about Harpoon 3's milspec, which the Australian navy has used for training.

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acelanceloet
Post subject: Re: Advanced Battleship (BBN)Posted: June 21st, 2011, 8:54 pm
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and now you ignore my entire post. btw, an game and once colonel is not what I call good sources, for which you can discard people with quite a lot experience, including an naval (defence) analist.

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CATZ
Post subject: Re: Advanced Battleship (BBN)Posted: June 21st, 2011, 8:56 pm
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acelanceloet wrote:
and now you ignore my entire post. btw, an game and once colonel is not what I call good sources, for which you can discard people with quite a lot experience, including an naval (defence) analist.
That Colonel wrote that thesis to complete his training as an analyst for Joint-Fires strategy and deployment. I'd say that gives him more than enough creditability.

And I ignored nothing about your post. As you noticed, I pointed out that tracking and engaging are two different things. In order for your scenario to be relevant, it'd have to track and engage 20+ targets at the same time. And that doesn't include the time it takes for it to lock and compute.

You also have to remember that the BBN is a different concept than the BB(X). That's why they are in different threads.

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TimothyC
Post subject: Re: Advanced Battleship (BBN)Posted: June 21st, 2011, 8:59 pm
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CATZ wrote:
<Snip BS by someone who doesn't know what they are talking about>
Yes the saturation level for AEGIS is classified, but in all likelihood it's set by the back-end, not the dielectric face. Anyone who says they know what he saturation level is is full of it.
CATZ wrote:
So you do acknowledge that Harpoon 3 is used for that purpose. Thank you. Thanks for validating that for me.
Was used, by Thailand. As far as I know they've switched over the Global Conflict Blue.
CATZ wrote:
What are your credentials for making you an expert on naval warfare? Being an engineer in training is great. Kudos to you for studying hard to become that. But that puts you no position as an expert on naval warfare. Sorry.
It means that I have a technical background from which to evaluate statements and designs. What background do you have?
CATZ wrote:
And they are building 1 more over the original 2 they had planned. I'd say that says quite a lot about a ship that was curved to make room for ships that have a higher priority for procurement. So Tim, that says absolutely nothing about the hull form. Especially since the DD(X) isn't intended (nor was it ever really) to replace the Arleigh Burke class.
And 29 less than the original plans called for, so yeah, it does say something about the hull form that it isn't being pursued outside of a small run of ships that will probably end up as test ships for most if not all of their lives.

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acelanceloet
Post subject: Re: Advanced Battleship (BBN)Posted: June 21st, 2011, 9:01 pm
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I was talking about engaging. ow and I forgot to say that the attack has to come from different directions as well, because otherwise the illimunators can track more then one target at the same time. and that gives the CIWS more chances.
and that colonel is still 1 person. 1 vs many.... hmm.....
he might have a point on some things, but everything written by just one person means there is opinion in it. and that it is readable for the public, and not confidential, shows that most likely that opinion is not the one of the US navy, but just his conclusion.

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KimWerner
Post subject: Re: Advanced Battleship (BBN)Posted: June 22nd, 2011, 3:05 pm
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Thiel wrote:
APDAF wrote:
It is mainly for psychological warfare as a bigger ship looks harder to kill and the more and bigger guns you have the more you can scare and kill.
Not really. There's no case in recorded history where someone surrendered because of naval gunfire alone.
Oh, yes! The british bombardment of Copenhagen in 1807 ;)

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Thiel
Post subject: Re: Advanced Battleship (BBN)Posted: June 22nd, 2011, 3:15 pm
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KimWerner wrote:
Thiel wrote:
APDAF wrote:
It is mainly for psychological warfare as a bigger ship looks harder to kill and the more and bigger guns you have the more you can scare and kill.
Not really. There's no case in recorded history where someone surrendered because of naval gunfire alone.
Oh, yes! The british bombardment of Copenhagen in 1807 ;)
Like I said, nobody has surrendered to Naval gunfire alone. Copenhagen were encircled by the British Army and the only Danish army units, mostly levy troops, within reach were defeated while on the march. The rest of the Army were far away in souther Jutland preparing to defend us against Napoleon if that were to become necessary and wouldn't be able to return to Zealand until winter when the Belts froze over.

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KimWerner
Post subject: Re: Advanced Battleship (BBN)Posted: June 22nd, 2011, 3:50 pm
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Thiel wrote:
Not really. There's no case in recorded history where someone surrendered because of naval gunfire alone.
Oh, yes! The british bombardment of Copenhagen in 1807 ;)
Thiel wrote:
Like I said, nobody has surrendered to Naval gunfire alone. Copenhagen were encircled by the British Army and the only Danish army units, mostly levy troops, within reach were defeated while on the march. The rest of the Army were far away in souther Jutland preparing to defend us against Napoleon if that were to become necessary and wouldn't be able to return to Zealand until winter when the Belts froze over.
Sorry, I missed the word "naval", but for sure it was the bombardment from both sea and land - used as a weapon of terror - that forced the capitulation. ;)

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