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CATZ
Post subject: Re: Advanced Battleship (BBN)Posted: June 17th, 2011, 6:13 pm
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Thiel
Post subject: Re: Advanced Battleship (BBN)Posted: June 17th, 2011, 6:41 pm
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Aside from all the issues that still remain from before, your torpedo tubes wont fit there. Unless you have a beam just shy of 52m at deck level then they'll interfere with the gun. (21" tubes are typically between 8 and 10m long. You need the same amount of space to reload and your turret takes up another 20m) The forward tubes will interfere with the VLS for much the same reason. The ones amidship will interfere with the powerplant.

The VLS will get damaged the first time you fire the A gun ahead at low elevation.
The arm launched SAM will get damaged the first time you fire the B turret in a broadside, and so will all the Spyski plates in the vicinity

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CATZ
Post subject: Re: Advanced Battleship (BBN)Posted: June 18th, 2011, 2:43 am
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Thiel wrote:
Aside from all the issues that still remain from before, your torpedo tubes wont fit there. Unless you have a beam just shy of 52m at deck level then they'll interfere with the gun. (21" tubes are typically between 8 and 10m long. You need the same amount of space to reload and your turret takes up another 20m) The forward tubes will interfere with the VLS for much the same reason. The ones amidship will interfere with the powerplant.

The VLS will get damaged the first time you fire the A gun ahead at low elevation.
The arm launched SAM will get damaged the first time you fire the B turret in a broadside, and so will all the Spyski plates in the vicinity
Quote:
Aside from all the issues that still remain from before, your torpedo tubes wont fit there. Unless you have a beam just shy of 52m at deck level then they'll interfere with the gun. (21" tubes are typically between 8 and 10m long. You need the same amount of space to reload and your turret takes up another 20m)
They could be angled/slanted, in which case they would fit. I think I'll move them though, just a little bit.
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The forward tubes will interfere with the VLS for much the same reason. The ones amidship will interfere with the powerplant.
The ship has 32-38 ft of freeboard and a 36 ft draft. There's no way those would interfere with the power-plant.
Quote:
The VLS will get damaged the first time you fire the A gun ahead at low elevation.
The arm launched SAM will get damaged the first time you fire the B turret in a broadside, and so will all the Spyski plates in the vicinity
I doubt it. Turrets fire over the top of each other throughout history usually without concequence. Also, the Iowa's were capable of firing forward, and the forces of said action didn't damage the decks (which were wooden).

The B turret couldn't damage the arm launcher in a broadside. It's impossible, since the guns would be out and over the side of the ship. Same thing with the radar.

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CATZ
Post subject: Re: Advanced Battleship (BBN)Posted: June 18th, 2011, 2:55 am
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Rodondo
Post subject: Re: Advanced Battleship (BBN)Posted: June 18th, 2011, 3:55 am
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CATZ, few points I noticed

1-(like Thiel said)The A turrets blast will, probably as a combination of sudden heat and pressure, cause the silo hatches to change shape, possibly jamming them or opening the contents to the elements. If not that, they would break.

2- the large turrets are a godawful shape for internal mechanisms and are they single?

3- you don't really need the torpedoes, escorts do that

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CATZ
Post subject: Re: Advanced Battleship (BBN)Posted: June 18th, 2011, 5:46 am
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Rodondo wrote:
CATZ, few points I noticed

1-(like Thiel said)The A turrets blast will, probably as a combination of sudden heat and pressure, cause the silo hatches to change shape, possibly jamming them or opening the contents to the elements. If not that, they would break.

2- the large turrets are a godawful shape for internal mechanisms and are they single?

3- you don't really need the torpedoes, escorts do that
Quote:
3- you don't really need the torpedoes, escorts do that
It needs torpedoes to operate an active torpedo defense. Anti-torpedo torpedoes as the USN has taken to calling them. Probably a ruskie version. Other than that, I believe in the USN's multi-mission ship philosophy. It's intended as a modern ship, and it should reflect that.
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2- the large turrets are a godawful shape for internal mechanisms and are they single?
A 20m wide turret with one gun?

No...

They're quads.

And I would assume that they have no barbettes. They'd have a below deck lattice work for support (hull integrity issue). Other than that. Truth be told, since they are modern, I doubt they'd resemble WW I & WW II major caliber turrets very much. In the same way that modern smaller and intermediate caliber turrets don't have much in common with the older turrets featuring similar caliber guns. Other than that I leave it up to the imagination of the reader/viewer. I imagine they'd have some type of mechanism of retracting or shielding the guns though.

Quote:
1-(like Thiel said)The A turrets blast will, probably as a combination of sudden heat and pressure, cause the silo hatches to change shape, possibly jamming them or opening the contents to the elements. If not that, they would break.
Like I said before, I doubt it. They could just build them with heavier hatches if the engineers foresaw it as a possibility. I've heard of ships damaging superstructure and decks before with larger guns. But it seems to be an issue of poor design, more than anything else. VLS are designed to hot launch missiles. If turrets can super-fire over each-other, or fire forward without damaging their decks, then it stands to reason, that they'd be able to fire over steel VLS hatches.

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CATZ
Post subject: Re: Advanced Battleship (BBN)Posted: June 18th, 2011, 6:14 am
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Thiel wrote:
No you can't. So far nobody has managed to design a seal that allows rapid linear movement and remains watertight. And while what you say about freeboard would be true with a conventional bow, you've chosen a bow specifically designed to let water over it.
Someone needs to tell that to whoever designed this:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/French_sub ... 28N_N_3%29

&

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/HM_Submarine_X1

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Andorianus
Post subject: Re: Advanced Battleship (BBN)Posted: June 18th, 2011, 8:59 am
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There still is my question from the previous page:
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Okay, so in all honesty I am a newb too; I have only drawed one SB drawing before. But I have picked up enough here and on Nationstates to give you some advice here. And that is:

1: Why so many different missiles? You currently have 29 different types! What do all those missiles do?
2: Why so many guns? It looks like overkill for shore bombardment, way too expensive too.
3: Why so many SPY-1 plates? Do 20 plates work better then four or something?
4: Why so many CIWS systems? I count seven of them. That is more then any warship I know of.

In short, this thing has too much of everything, sorry. Aside from that, I would argue that this ship would not be of much use for anything, sorry. I hate to say it, but the guns are overkill for supporting landings, and for a cruiser it is just too large. You know, if you ask you'd be better off trying again. Sorry.

But cheer up. No one gets it exactly right the first time. You know what they say, practice makes perfect, so don't give up! ;-)

Hope this helps.

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TimothyC
Post subject: Re: Advanced Battleship (BBN)Posted: June 18th, 2011, 2:19 pm
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CATZ wrote:
A 20m wide turret with one gun?

No...

They're quads.

And I would assume that they have no barbettes. They'd have a below deck lattice work for support (hull integrity issue). Other than that. Truth be told, since they are modern, I doubt they'd resemble WW I & WW II major caliber turrets very much. In the same way that modern smaller and intermediate caliber turrets don't have much in common with the older turrets featuring similar caliber guns. Other than that I leave it up to the imagination of the reader/viewer. I imagine they'd have some type of mechanism of retracting or shielding the guns though.
Then draw quads, because what you have now are triples at best (I'll leave it as a geometry exercise for the reader to figure out how they can't be quads). As for the shape of the gun, there is a reason why people have used flat surfaces for over a century. The only reason that armor with significant curves was ever used was that people didn't know how to make flat plate armor in the sizes and thicknesses needed, and the curved process IIRC didn't scale very well.

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Carnac
Post subject: Re: Advanced Battleship (BBN)Posted: June 18th, 2011, 8:37 pm
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I thought there was a few cases in Soviet tank design where a curved dome was used for it's greater effective thickness for weight. But as you said, it doesn't scale well.

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