Shipbucket

Here is the link to a drawing I made a while ago of an actual German design from 1928 http://www.shipbucket.com/forums/viewto ... lit=moltke

I have modified my own drawing slightly to make it fit this challenge, because, you know, there isn't enough German representation...



Sorry for all the old parts, I've been meaning to come back and redraw this to the current standards but I've been busy working on the USS Constellation 1854 in drydock all winter and have had no free time.

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"All men dream, but not equally. Those who dream by night in the dusty recesses of their minds wake in the day to find that it was vanity, but the dreamers of the day are dangerous men, for they may act their dreams with open eyes, to make it possible. This I did." Thomas Edward Lawrence, The Seven Pillars of Wisdom

That's a powerful looking Raider, Syzmo. That ship would take a lot of stopping.

I've had a look at your earlier thread, Syzmo, which has some great drawings. Just a point about the background history there. There was no minimum limit to capital ship size set in the 1922 Washington Treaty other than the stipulation that all ships over 10,000tons with guns over 8in were capital ships. French and Italian designs of 17,500 or 23,300 tons were simply the arithmetic of building 2 or 3 ships within their special allowances for construction of 35,000 or 70,000 tons before the general 10 year 'building holiday' ended.
There was a ban in the 1936 London Treaty: "No capital ship of standard displacement less than 17,500 tons nor any whose main armament consists of guns of less than 10 in. calibre, shall be laid down or acquired prior to 1 January 1943."

I have done the same as Smurf and reviewed your earlier drawings and must admit that I like the 8x12" gunned version of the original. Having a bit more displacement to play with could give you a slightly bigger ship with better armour. I'm not sure the change to 9x11" would give you anything more than the 12" version.

Having said that the drawings are all well executed, and it probably comes down to personal choice. (Oh dear, I feel another kitbash coming on....... save me, save me... Smurf, you got any oddities I can have a crack at?)

Interesting work and discussions.

Well .... as this is 25000ton battleships my love of cruisers doesn't fit. I'm also into 'neverweres' rather than personal inventions, and I've committed to Hood if he continues his Interwar Capital Ships beyond Nelson.
But I do know of one pair, a bit smaller than 25,000tons, for which there are no drawings so far as I know, so you could use your imagination on them in personal designs. In 1930-32, Charles Lillicrap, the chief cruiser designer, was seconded to the battleship section of the RCNC to design two small battlecruisers as examples for the 1932 Geneva talks on arms limitation.
1930. 20,000tons 680' waterline, beam 84', 90' over bulges; draught 22'; (3x2)12" or 10" (6x2)6" 6x4.7". Armour 9" side, 5" deck. 80,000shp for 30knots.
1932. 18,500tons 660', beam 83ft draught 21' (3x2)10" (4x2)6" (4x2)HA (2x8)2pdr. Armour 8" side, 3"+1" deck 80,000shp, 30 knots
Figures from his Workbook, with a weight breakdown and notes about armour to defeat 12" shells and poor underwater protection of second design (assume no bulges?)
So a bigger ship than Lillicrap usually designed, but his style in the days of Leanders, Amphion and Arethusa?

Those sound interesting Smurf, I am doing one for Spain at the moment based off the Ebro design heavy cruiser upgraded with 12" and 4.5", 7" belt 4" deck, so it will be interesting to see how it looks compared to your above figures.

Interesting how often real life is imitated by our own imaginations. I was already nearly finished the Ebro (below) when Smurf gave the details of the Lillicrap designs.

Mine ended up 684.5 feet by 88 feet draught a bit deeper at 26 feet. Armament is 8x12" (4x2), 12x4.5" (6x2), 16x2pd (4x4), 28x0.5"mg. 3 Aircraft, and a crew of approx. 1100. Machinery at 4 shaft geared turbines, 90,000shp for 30 knots on 31,000 full load displacement (25,000 tons standard). Armour was a modest 8" belt and 4" deck.

My last entry here is one I have had around for a while but did not post as Hood had said he might try one of these. It is a Nelsonian version of the battleship I did for post one.

Because of its reduced size it has a more comprehensive armour scheme, better underwater protection etc. The problem it has over the normal layout and bigger sized vessel is the lack of room for improvements to AA weapons, aircraft handling arrangements, and future Radar / directors.

Pretty much what I would have posted, except for different secondaries etc.

For what its worth, I simmed this is SS for Nigel, and it comes out around 25,500 tons standard so its one of the more doable mini-Nelsons.

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