Shipbucket

i have opened this thread to try and work out some funadamentals for a new AU. i will still be continuing with My New Croner AU Which im trying to keep tied in with real life events and time scales as much as possible but my new ideais a radicl shake up of history.

so here are the fundamentals...

i break from reality in the 1920's......

following the great depression in the 20's the British government is run by a very right wing Nationalist party and is tightning it grip on the members of the Empire..

when Hitler a right wing facist comes to power in germany the British and Germans and Italy under Musolini form the Brito-German-Italian Empire. there is no washinton treaty and the treaty of versile is abolished together the empire begins a rapid armament programme. over the 30's and 40' the empire carves up Europe over running France and Spain/Portugal as well as the balkans and Northern Europe with French and Dutch territories and colonies in the East and Africa falling under the Empires control. eventualy Europe is controlled by the Brito -German Empire and the Soviets. a state of tension exist between to two.

The US and Japan still have there war from 1941 but the Japanese are given assistance from the Brito German Empire. The US having no involvement in a war in Europe which would have ended swiftly. Soviets staying out of both European and Asian theatres.

This is how far ive got so far ideas and suggestions welcome.

Hi ya mate,

Does this mean that Japan shows no interest in British Colonial possessions in Asia or India?

If Japan still invades Burma, Hong Kong, Singapore, Wai Wai, et cetera, does that not mean that Britain enters the Pacific war on America's side de-facto?

If not, what assurances can/does Japan give Britain that her possessions are safe, baring in mind Japan would want the Dutch possessions for rubber and oil?

Would the Governments of Australia and New Zealand be satisfied with these arrangements and assured that their own security was guaranteed?

Andy

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Japan avoids any European asset in the pacific not wanting to get involved in a war with an alliance between Britain, Germany and italy.

As for the government s of Australia and New Zealand. With the British Empire tightening its reign on its assets i was intending to write some kind of war of independence into the AU in which Japan now allied with Britain, and Germany would become entangled.....

as for japans interest in dutch oil and rubber with the dutch assets falling the the British and German alliance and with the British helping the Japanese against the US im sure some deal on supply could be arranged.....

As i said i need to think about alot of things here i want to completely re write history.

Would the British and German alliance have nnuclear weapons sooner than in reality both had basic programmes as far back as the early 30's would the US get them later without the help of british scientist in the manhatten project....

A few bits of rambling thoughts,

Would GB and USA really fall out I think you need to go back to the Venezuelan crisis of 1895 to change that.

Not sure that GB would fall out with AUS/NZ as they where keen on a Federal empire (compared to CAN/SA) so if you fight them you lose everything (or at least all the dominions, you may be able to hold colony's by force ).

No WNT probably just ends up with a massive USN, a big RN and a smaller (proportionally) IJN so WW2 in Pacific will be different. (and Japan my learn that it cant fight US and hope to win.

Why would GB break the balance of power in Europe ? by supporting Germany ? a right wing Gov will be working in GBs self interest not Germany/Italy (and is unlikely to get on well with its allies).

Would a ruthless GB take the DEI itself ?

JSB

The British wouldn't lets say directly fall out with the US. At first The British German and Italian alliance would be Focused on Europe. With the US remaining Isolationist.

At some piont Japan still falls out with the US over assets in the pacific. With The alliance still settling Europe it strikes deals with Japan to protect its own assets in the Pacific as alot of force would be required to control taken European countries.

To ensure safety of British assets and newly aqquird ex french and dutch assets deals with japan may secure there safety until Europe is stable then maybe the alliance would turn attention to the East and Africa.

In other words a war in the Pacific is more of an inconvenience to the alliances plans and something that has to be ssolvedat arms length... at least at first.......

But, Would the US/J fight ?

J doesn't want the PI it wants the stuff behind it (DEI/GB colony's with rich deposits).

If they don't come south then why would they fight USA ? (and a USN without WNT will likely be bigger).

JSB

A USN without the constraints of the WNT would be a monster.

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Source Materiel is always welcome.

Not totally sure,

IJN will run out of cash (especially after Kanto quake) so stops/slows down.
RN will build the minimum it can to out build japan (but ships may be better due to battle experience)
USN will find congress getting less supportive after it has obviously won v Japan.

So maybe only a few more classes and then it would calm down (but that does mean all WW1 ships are totally obsolete in the land of 16' giants).

JSB

Aside from the fact that historically the US knew very little of what was going on in Japan at the time, I can't see how they wouldn't be at least a bit weary about a new territorially aggressive superpower with bases all over their interest zones. At the very least I'd be concerned about a GB/DE vs Japan war spilling over into general conquest of the western pacific.

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“Close” only counts with horseshoes, hand grenades, and tactical nuclear weapons.
That which does not kill me has made a grave tactical error

Worklist

Source Materiel is always welcome.

Humm...I have been thinking...what happens in South American Countries?

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