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I would, but it wouldn't do any good...French warships aren't exactly my specialty. My role is merely to admire their beautiful lines and the sheer awesomeness of the drawings that result.

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MS State Guard - 08 March 2014 - 28 January 2023

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Yes
But (the original background) is more "tortuous" than that

...and, of course you guys are referring to the conversions of the USS Boston (CAG-1) and USS Canberra (CAG-2) in your discussion. Thus, your reference to the much smaller Little Rocks (which, btw did not have the Terrier, but rather the bigger, more capable Talos) is irrelevant, since the JB would've, in all likelihood followed suit looking something like the Boston. Note too, that the Talos is not a viable alternative (in case someone would be tempted to use that system) - since the US did not allow export - not even to allies - of this missile-system! - And France with the General in charge was less of an ally than a nuissance!

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My Avatar:Петр Алексеевич Безобразов (Petr Alekseevich Bezobrazov), Вице-адмирал , царская ВМФ России(1845-1906) - I sign my drawings as Ari Saarinen

Would the MASURCA system fit in with the timeline of the Jean Bart conversion? Or do you wish to convert JB prior to 1960ish?

1) 1958 project = conversion during 1959-1962/1963

2) The Masurca was available only by 1965/1966 & in limited number (3 entire systems built by 1965/1972 for Suffren, Duquesne & Colbert, the 3rd Masurca system, initially intended for Jeanne d'Arc, finally ended onboard Colbert) and by 1966/1968 the Jean Bart hull/machinery began to be "increasingly worn-out (without a major overhaul)", so a Jean-Bart armed with Masurca was almost impossible (unless the French navy had completely rebuilt the ship, which is extremely unlikely because during the 1960s-1970s, much of the money went to the french nuclear deterrence (SSBN))

3) Do not forget that by 1969/1972, the French navy, due to budget constraints (money for the SSBN fleet), has been forced to "reduce" the modernization of the Colbert cruiser...


On the web, you can find few Jean-Bart drawings with Masurca (& even Exocet MM-38 missiles & flight-deck aft for helico or LCM aft !!!).
These drawings are only AU/fan-art, not very serious, made by few french naval-enthusiast (often "heavily" inspired by US IOWA conversions projects...)

Yes I can understand that and the problems associated with the missile conversion of a battleship. At the dates given for JB conversion the only viable option seems to be a US system. Is there any other source that the French could get their hands on to give an alternative? Just as something different to the standard US late 50's converts.

I went through a similar discussion when I did a battlecruiser conversion of a personal design and I ended up with the same answer you have. The early conversions of the Boston class were not that good, I was also pointed to the Little Rock conversions by TJ as a more complete conversion. With the extra size of JB you may be able to do more than I could on a much smaller design.

if we look at terrier installations only, in the date range (comissioned between 1959 and 1963 in foreign service) we see a few options emerge.
- Mk 4 GMLS
- Mk 9 GMLS
- Mk 10 GMLS

the Mk 4 lacks upgrade potential, and was exported only once. on second note, it was designed for replacing a tripple 8in turret IIRC, so if it is suitable would depend on where you put it. I don't think it would have been used though
the Mk 9 was never exported, and it was developed to be an on-deck installation fit to the CLG classes. on this ship thus, it would waste a lot of space, and the maximum fit of it would be one forward and one aft. there should be space belowdecks when turrets are removed (or the aircraft hanger, for that matter, I think) so I advice against this installation.
the Mk 10 was exported quite a bit, fits the timeframe the best, and on a ship like this it has the largest magazine size you could possibly fit on board. (2 or 3 times the 80 missile magazine seems not too far fetched)
it also has the diagonal loader viriant that facilitates in-line installation and has growth potential in missile types, as the USN never developed the other launchers any further.
the drawback of the Mk 10 is that it lacks beam, but that could allow the space to fit Mk 13 or Mk 11 launchers or additional guns. there is no system though that really uses all the available beam effectively, you could come closer with the bigger Mk 12 Talos system but (wikipedia says so, that is) the french looked at terrier.

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I have youre answer Ace
The french navy only expected the Terrier with Mk 10 launcher (during the 1957-1961 period)

By 1962, the French navy look toward the newer Tartar with Mk 13 launcher

that would mean that the missile conversion that this design should be based off would be closer to the zeven provincien and the italian terrier cruiser(s?) then to the USN conversions

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Drawings are credited with J.Scholtens
I ask of you to prove me wrong. Not say I am wrong, but prove it, because then I will have learned something new.
Shipbucket Wiki admin

The Jean Bart in 1958 Guided Missile Battleship Conversion Proposal:



The Final Instalment willbe Jean Bart 1962-1964 as a Command Ship for the French Nuclear Test Program, stay tuned.

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French Vice-admiral Louis-René-Madeleine Le Vassor de La Touche, comte de Tréville
The original spelling of my last name is: LaTouche.