Shipbucket

I'm refining designs and planned ship refits/modifications for 1942, and wanted to check my knowledge against the rest of the forum membership. Please point out any contradictions/redundancies/ommissions in what I plan to add to RTX ships for that year:

Small ships (DD, DE):
US SG for surface search
US Mk4 for fire control
Radio DF loop

Capital ships (CL, CA, BB)
US CXAM for air search
US Mk3 for main battery fire control
US Mk4 for secondary battery fire control

What have I missed?

My knowledge base on radar and electronics is incomplete for WWII and later. Any help is appreciated.

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Redhorse

Current Projects:
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FD Scale F-14s

You've got it pretty much correct. The only notes I might add are as follows:

- SG is pretty advanced for 1942 (especially early 1942). It existed, but not in large numbers and its installations were problematic. I've never been able to figure out why, but there were problems with waveguide losses that meant the SG antenna had to be mounted especially close to the radar plot - hence its usual mid-war location ahead of battleship fire control towers or low on cruiser foremasts. Once the waveguide losses were solved (sometime in 1944 from what I can tell), the SGs were moved to their usual spots atop foremast and mainmast extensions. I had a sheet somewhere that described USN surface combatant radar fits but I think I deleted it during the last house cleaning...

- Early air search for DDs and CLs will be the SC set. BB1987 has recently redrawn it (like today I think) and I still need to look at it and make sure it's correct - though if I trust anyone on here to get it right, I trust him.

- CLs would not mount CXAM or CXAM-1 - it was too heavy. Only the BBs, CVs, and CAs could mount it.

- Mark 4 "FD" as a fire control radar in 1942 is correct - it along with Mark 3 "FC" were the early USN fire control units. Mark 3 had several Mods that looked different - see the radar section in the sheet in my signature for details. In 1942, almost all FC installations seem to be the early Mod 1 type (the 6x6' square vs. the 12x3' oblong Mk.3 Mod.2).

- Radio direction finding was standard to almost all ships (from what I can tell) and a simple loop was mounted usually behind the pilot house or between the stacks. Don't forget the "corrector" antenna - used to calibrate the loop!

- The TBS (Talk Between Ships) tactical radio seems to appear in 1942 as well. Look for a small antenna with a four-section ground plane mounted on yards or above pilot houses.

- Unrelated, but 1.1" quads were directed at first by the crude Mk.44 gun director, and later by the Mk.49 - find both in the sheet in my signature.

To my mind, the "standard" refit sequence for a large surface combatant (CA or BB) goes as follows:

1. 1941: no fire control radar, CXAM or CXAM-1 air search, no surface search, no whip antennas, lots of wire antennas, radio DF loops
2. 1942: Mk.3 Mod.1 "FC" sets on main battery directors, CXAM-1, no surface search, a few whips, late 1942 sees "FD" radars on Mk.37 directors, 1.1" quads directed by Mk.44 or Mk.49 directors
3. 1943: Mk.3 Mod.2 "FC sets on main battery directors, SK air search radar, SG surface search (bracketed to the fire control tower), more whips, Mk.4 "FD" antennas on Mk.37, 40mm Bofors directed by Mk.49 or Mk.51 directors
4. 1944: Mk.8 "FH" radars on main battery directors, SK air search, 2x SG surface search (one above the foremast, one above the mainmast), more whips, Mk.12/22 antennas on Mk.37, early ECM sets (SPR-1 with AS-56 and AS-57 antennas on yards, DBM radar direction finders, possibly TDY depending on the yard period), 40mm Bofors directed by Mk.51 and (occasionally) Mk.57 directors
5. 1945: Mk.8 Mod.3 "FH" radar on main battery directors, SK-2 air search, 2x SG surface search in same locations, MORE whips, late-war ECM sets ("Derby" and "Sword" monitoring antennae, TDY-1 jammer, TDY monitoring antenna, DBM-1 radar direction finders), possibly SM or SP (height finders) on mainmast, or possibly SC-2 or SR (backup air search sets), Nancy IR beacons on the air defense level, Mk.27 ranging radar above the conning tower or on top of turret #2, 40mm Bofors directed by Mk.51 and more and more Mk.57 directors with their associated radar.

Let me know if you have questions...

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Might be the radar-fit sheet Colo is talking about (warning, some radars, if not all, are outdated)

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Ian, I believe the early-war waveguide losses were due to a lack of thorough understanding of waveguide design. Waveguides can be reasonably thought of as a "pipe" for the RF emissions, which have both fluid-like and optical-like characteristics in this situation. Corners, for example, can be very problematic. Waveguides must also have a controlled atmosphere, and suffer particularly from humidity at high frequencies. This could very well have presented in the south Pacific; later and more modern techniques involve a positive-pressure waveguide filled with dry air. SG was notable as one of the first US S-band search radars, and as such was a pioneer in waveguide design and operation. The British experienced similar waveguide-loss problems with their Type 271.

Thanks very much. This helps decide what gets fitted when I adjust some drawings for 1942, and what might be needed for backstories concerning the problems with early radar sets.

The photos I've seen of the Fletcher Class destroyers built by Consolidated Steel's Orange Yard in Texas have the SG on the foremast in late 1942 (DDs 569-580). The first four commissioned between October and December of that year. The photos of DD-570 Charles Ausburne on navsource.org were particularly helpful. I figured I could do the same with the next RTX destroyer class.

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Redhorse

Current Projects:
Republic of Texas Navy
FD Scale F-14s

Sounds entirely reasonable - I had never encountered the actual "fix" the problems, but you're probably spot on.

Re: BB1987's sheet, that's the one - as he notes, almost all of those radars are obsolete and out of scale (don't use them), but the facts presented are (mostly) correct if a bit amateurish in their understanding. The only correction I'd make is to the CL-107 Fargo mast setup: the radomes on the the main topmast are my early attempt to draw the DBM radar direction finder, and there is no "RF jamming equipment" (as noted) on that mast. Radar jamming would have been performed by an associated TDY or TDY-1 jammer antenna mounted aft of the funnel (on CL-107 at least), and I'm actually not sure what equipment would have jammed radio transmissions (if any).

The ECM equipment (both the "early" SPR-1, with its AS-56 and AS-57 antennas, as well as the later SPR-2 with "Derby" and "Sword") are on my list of things to draw, along with corrected versions of DBM, the TDY radomes, and the TDY-1 jammer antenna. Just haven't had time as I've been moving apartments over the last 2 weeks.
SG in late 1942 is a no-brainer - the technologies were advancing so rapidly during this time that it's actually more reasonable to separate "eras" based on months, rather than years!

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USN components, camouflage colors, & reference links (World War II only)