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TimothyC
Post subject: Re: Kingdom of the netherlandsPosted: January 21st, 2011, 10:39 pm
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MitcheLL300 wrote:
I need some new stuff for the navy...

In around 2010-2030 i need these:
Anti air missile ''ciws'' (Like ram)
RAM. The US is exporting it quite widely.
Quote:
Stealth CIWS (Replacing goalkeeper)
Either Millennium , the 57mm Bofors or a stealth shield over Goalkeeper. Eventually you may want to look at something like LADS.
Quote:
Sea attack helicopter (Navalized apache aint going to work)
Radar and missiles on your general utility / ASW helicopter. For specialized equipment, a navalized Tiger or Mangusta might work, as might the old standby - the AH-1Z Viper.
Quote:
Tech for a catamaran frigate (For test bed ship)
New tech?
  1. New Active Phased Arrays capable of being used as weapons themselves
  2. Railguns (near the end of the time)
  3. Solid State Lasers
  4. New power plants (maybe Fusion by 2030 if we're lucky)
Quote:
Where am i going to find the tech from(Wich countries?).
And anybody has a idea for designs?
Well The Netherlands has had historic ties to both the UK and the US for systems procurement, so start there and look at other western European nations.

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Vossiej
Post subject: Re: Kingdom of the netherlandsPosted: January 22nd, 2011, 10:19 am
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Mitch, I would like to see your fleet of smaller patrol vessels. I can't find those other 60 anywhere.

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Mitchell van Os
Post subject: Re: Kingdom of the netherlandsPosted: January 22nd, 2011, 5:43 pm
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Vossiej wrote:
Mitch, I would like to see your fleet of smaller patrol vessels. I can't find those other 60 anywhere.
First post in this topic made by me.
You should read it ;)

''The fleet list from 1980 to later:
Every fleet list counts 60 ships added to the large surface and submarine fleet.
This is because i think it has to be 60 to maintain all the Tugs, hydrographic, mine counter measure ships, transport ships, royal yacht, coast guard, etc etc.''

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viewtopic.php?f=14&t=9802&p=193331#p193331
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Embarked on: HNLMS Karel Doorman A833
To do list:
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-Clemencau class aircraft carrier
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-Poolster class AOR
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Vossiej
Post subject: Re: Kingdom of the netherlandsPosted: January 22nd, 2011, 7:18 pm
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I know Mitch, but what I meant was a more closer description to what these 60 ships entitle.

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Mitchell van Os
Post subject: Re: Kingdom of the netherlandsPosted: January 22nd, 2011, 10:17 pm
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Vossiej wrote:
I know Mitch, but what I meant was a more closer description to what these 60 ships entitle.
As said in large:
the Tugs, hydrographic, mine counter measure ships, transport ships, royal yacht, coast guard,

This means all the sidenote ships for the navy.
Tugs
Coast guard
Test ships
Hydrographic ships
Royal yacht
Transport ships
Mine counter measure ships
Torpedo help ships
Crane ships
Floating docks
Whatever you can think of that should be in the navy.
The navy also uses civilian stuff. But that should not be in here.

Also, i am thinking currently about the Escort carriers, because that would be a fun job to draw.

I was thinking of:

Hr Ms Kaapstad RL81(Named after famous dutch city in south africa)(Not to be mentioned with R81 Karel Doorman)

Build: 1941(As Uss Copahee CVE-12)
Launched: 1941(As Lend-Lease ship Hr Ms Kijkduin RL81,(Official Hull number) QH16)
Returned: 1945(War was over, Lend-Lease stopped)
Acquired: 1949(HMS Nairana(Hr Ms Karel Doorman QH1) Returned to the british navy, so the Copahee was bought from the USA)
Decommisioned: 1979
Fate: Placed in Reserve at the Waddensea Reserve Fleet(WRF1 or 2) till 1989 when she was sold for scrap

Story:
In 1941 the USA offered the Uss Copahee to the netherlands to protect itself from the japanese in the pacific. The Netherlands accepted the offer and brought the Uss Copahee(Then named Kijkduin QH16) to Portsmouth where a part of the Dutch Headquarters was.
She undertook there a small modification to the radar systems, and AA lay-out.
After gaving the ship a crew and air force, they started doing some basic training in end 1941 between the UK and Ireland.
She was official called to be read for action in start 1942, when she received her official escorts (1 merchant ship, and 2 destroyers. Also a british cruiser(With UK crew) went with her to the Pacific)
She sank there:
1 Japanese destroyer
3 Japanese merchant ships
2 Japanese Submarines
She was called the feared holland by the Japanese and was the most succesfull dutch warship in that area in WW2.

She returned to the US navy by 1945.
She served as a transport ship for troops and aircraft between the pacific area's and the USA in 1945. And in begin 1946 she transfered british troops and aircraft between the pacific and the UK.
In 1946 mid she was finally taken into the USA Reserve fleet till 1949 where the Netherlands bought the ship.
The ship has only changed by looks because of rusting and other factors.
But all the Dutch modifications and language on board was still there.
The ship was modificated in 1958 to enclose the sides a bit more, improve the bridge and its equipment(Navigation, interior, exterior).
Also her flight deck was enlarged at the bow and rear, where it also got enclosed. This was done to use her lenght at 100%. And ofcourse the heavier propellor planes needed some more space to start up.
By 1963 she was stated to be a Helicopter carrier, and mostly performed Coast guard operation in South africa (Where she was stationed)
In 1967 a british hawker siddley harrier was leased to the netherlands to test out if it could take of the 153m long flight deck.

They noticed that with empty load the harrier could take off within 80 meters with a good pilot.
When on full load it was unbarable to see her take off, she needs more then 130m on this carrier.

The carrier was converted to carry even heavier aircraft(Stronger beams under flight deck, removal of some stuff in hangar), because with the come of the Sikorsky SH-3 Sea King and the harrier.
The ships new aircraft layout was:
4x Hawker harrier(With different lay-out options)
2x Sikorsky SH-3 Sea King armed coast guard helicopters
2x Sikorsky SH-3 Sea King ASW

She also maintained 4 Westland Wasp ASW helicopter time to time. Depending on her missions.

She was Decommisioned in 1979 and placed in the Waddensea Reserve fleet (WRF1, or 2).She was sold for scrap in 1989 with a pending end of the Soviet Union.



Hr Ms Hollandia RL82(Named after Capital of Dutch New Guinea)
(Hollandia class Light carrier)
Lenght:176 meters(Flight deck) 170 meters(Hull)
Build: 1957
Launched: 1957
Acquired: 1958
Decommisioned: 1989
Fate: Placed in Reserve at the Waddensea Reserve Fleet2 till 1992 when she was sold as museum to amsterdam naval museum.

Story:
She was ordered finally after a lot of humble by the dutch government. She was mostly needed to patrol the area at Dutch New Guinea because of the Dutch-Indonesian tensions between each other.
She started building in 1957 and launched the same year. She is a practical and good 170meter long Light carrier. She still does not compare with the Karel Doorman since she is 214meter long.
When she finished building she inmidiatly gained a modification at her bridge. She gained a new air search radar, surface search radar. Tracking radars. Navigation radars.
But not to forget, she was the first ship smaller then a Collusus class carrier to receive and angled deck.
This was because she was planned with Jet planes. A riskfull action because it never was proven to be possible to launch and land a S-2 Tracker on such a small land deck.
With that in the back of the head she was finished as an angled deck carrier, with a 176m long flight deck. And possible to increase to 178, but never done.

She made some succesfull actions at vietnam war during her period there.
She is part of the eastern navy, wich was called upon that war to help the United states out with patroling.
Eventually this led into planes from the Hollandia to targed a few Vietnamese targets when she had boms pending to go over datum.

Hollandia was decommisioned in 1989, and served in the Waddensea Reserve Fleet2 with a period of 6 months to be called upon active. She was sold in 1992 to the Amsterdam naval museum when the Cold war officially ended.

Hr Ms Kijkduin RL83
(Hollandia Class Light carrier)
Lenght:181 meters(Flight deck), 178meters(Hull)
Build: 1964
Launched: 1965
Acquired: 1967
Decommisioned: 2000/2001
Fate: Placed in Reserve at the Waddensea Reserve Fleet1 till 2018 when she was officially replaced by Karel Doorman L804


Story:
With 1 Light carrier and 2 Escort carriers, the dutch navy was in the top of strenght since a long time.
The navy was one of the strongest in the world with 3 carriers in its assortiment.
But there was still a need for an extra carrier to serve with the eastern fleet. With the Karel Doorman 2 in repairs from time to time.
Plans where for a second Hollandia class aircraft carrier since 1962. But the Government of that time refused it, and the new formed one in 1963/4 gave an OK sign.
In 1964 the plans where ready, and end 1964 she started building. She was an enlarged Hollandia class carrier. And inmidiatly angled deck instead of flush deck build.
When finished the navy aquired hawker siddley harrier's, and with already 1 escort carrier filled with 4 harriers, this one was to be destended to carry them also.
The Hollandia and Karel doorman remained partial Helicopter carriers with S-2 trackers at this time.(Hollandia gained harriers in 1972).
She carried 6 harriers and 10 additional helicopters of medium size.

She only did some large operations at lebanon and yugoslavia.
Apart from that she only saw escort operation's, and training.
She was finally paid off and send to Reserve at 2000 end/start 2001. And was held in the Waddensea reserve fleet1 till 2018 when she was replaced by Karel Doorman L804.
After that she maintained her spot in the reserve fleet, but was not maintained so she could be active again.
She sank in 2016 one time during a broken hatch near her screw, but this was seen early so she didnt sank all the way to the bottom.
In 2020 she started sinking again, this time because of rust. They let her sink all the way to the bottom because the costs where to high to repair the ship.
She did not wear any enviorement damaging stuff, so her status was changed to artifactial reef. And not on purpose.
Many people tried to raise money to buy her for an museum, to be placed in rotterdam.
But this was failed.
A beautiful ship, with a sad ending.



*Start of RL81, made out of found CVE's on my pc, without credits. Who can identify?*
Attachment:
CVE RL81.png

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Fryssian AU with Lt.Maverick 114
viewtopic.php?f=14&t=9802&p=193331#p193331
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Embarked on: HNLMS Karel Doorman A833
To do list:
-Zeven Provincien class cruiser
-Joint support ship all sides
-F124 Sachsen class frigate
-F125 Baden-Württemberg class frigate
-Clemencau class aircraft carrier
-Zeven provincien class frigate
-Poolster class AOR
-Amsterdam class AOR
-Minas Gerais aircraft carrier


Last edited by Mitchell van Os on January 23rd, 2011, 12:48 am, edited 1 time in total.

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Vossiej
Post subject: Re: Kingdom of the netherlandsPosted: January 23rd, 2011, 12:18 am
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I believe those where done by Colosseum... Strange though because they did not show up during my search on Shipbucket.com

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bezobrazov
Post subject: Re: Kingdom of the netherlandsPosted: January 23rd, 2011, 12:28 am
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R u sure that the Kijkduin is named after that town and not the naval battle off that place in the English Channel, in 1673???

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Mitchell van Os
Post subject: Re: Kingdom of the netherlandsPosted: January 23rd, 2011, 12:47 am
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bezobrazov wrote:
R u sure that the Kijkduin is named after that town and not the naval battle off that place in the English Channel, in 1673???
Oh crapos, the copy-paste part from Hollandia is still behind the name of Kijkduin.
Fail :oops:

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Fryssian AU with Lt.Maverick 114
viewtopic.php?f=14&t=9802&p=193331#p193331
[ img ]
Embarked on: HNLMS Karel Doorman A833
To do list:
-Zeven Provincien class cruiser
-Joint support ship all sides
-F124 Sachsen class frigate
-F125 Baden-Württemberg class frigate
-Clemencau class aircraft carrier
-Zeven provincien class frigate
-Poolster class AOR
-Amsterdam class AOR
-Minas Gerais aircraft carrier


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Mitchell van Os
Post subject: Re: Kingdom of the netherlandsPosted: January 23rd, 2011, 5:18 pm
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Attachment:
Hr ms Hollandia RL82(1958+).png
Start of the Hr Ms Hollandia RL82.
Anybody has an idea for an 1958 weapon layout?
I was thinking of 3x bofors 40mm duals, and 2x salute canon on each side.

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Fryssian AU with Lt.Maverick 114
viewtopic.php?f=14&t=9802&p=193331#p193331
[ img ]
Embarked on: HNLMS Karel Doorman A833
To do list:
-Zeven Provincien class cruiser
-Joint support ship all sides
-F124 Sachsen class frigate
-F125 Baden-Württemberg class frigate
-Clemencau class aircraft carrier
-Zeven provincien class frigate
-Poolster class AOR
-Amsterdam class AOR
-Minas Gerais aircraft carrier


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Obsydian Shade
Post subject: Re: Kingdom of the netherlandsPosted: February 14th, 2011, 4:52 am
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Just a thought, but for a Goalkeeper replacement, have you considered something like Metal Storm?

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