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MC Spoilt B'stard
Post subject: Dutch Navy unveils M-frigate replacement conceptPosted: November 7th, 2013, 6:16 pm
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The Dutch navy revealed it's first concept of a new generation of frigates. The ships are replacing the 90s M-frigates in the Dutch navy around 2023. The Dutch navy and Damen Schelde naval shipbuilding are working together in designing and building the ships.

Basic info so-far:
Lenght: +/-145 m
Crew: 120 persons

Weapons:
- 1x76mm cannon
- 16x cells mk-41 VLS (ESSM) possible also SM-2 or other missiles
- 2x 30mm Marlin WS
- 2x Hitrole remote HMG
- 4x Harpoon ASuW missile
- 1x CIWS (unknown system)

Its main role will be ASW there for a hangar and a big flight deck (type 26 style)
under the flight deck a slipway is fitted for FRISC's. Midships there is space for 4 Unmanned Surface Vessels (USV) from this deck the you can also enter the helicopter hangar. The ship will probably not be fitted with a MCM option due to magnetism problems.
The ship will be a co-product with the Belgian navy.

[ img ]
Quote:
The 3D printed model of the "replacement M-frigates" as was shown during Tech Base.
[ img ]
Quote:
The bow is remarkably long and the mast with sensors is renewed.
[ img ]
Quote:
closed stern by adding a slipway. Behind the helideck the ship can be moored.
[ img ]
Quote:
Three of the four USV units next to the ship, one is still in the midship
(Photo's : Jaime Karremann/ Marineschepen.nl)


To me it looks like a very cheap concept, somethings look like other ship designs;
- Helicopter deck looks like Type 26 deck
- The bow style looks like me something italian and/or French

[Edit] I asked the website for more pictures, if i get them i will give it a try to draw this concept, if i dont get them i try to do my best with these 4.

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Vossiej
Post subject: Re: Dutch Navy unveils M-frigate replacement conceptPosted: November 7th, 2013, 8:04 pm
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Looks like the design follows the same aspects as the Type 26, FREMM and F125 class frigates. I hope the Netherlands and the UK see certain opportunities to co-develop their frigates as they are scheduled to be commissioned around the same period.

About the Harpoons, four seem incorrect. Indeed only one missile launcher is shown, but this is your usual 4-cell launcher. It would be crazy to have just one launcher with four missiles installed facing the same direction. Also, around the 2020's I expect the Harpoon to be replaced by a more modern (and more versatile) anti-ship missile, at least withing Dutch naval service that is.

Also, the installment of any kind of ship-launched torpedo system is a definite must.

All together it looks like a great start, but nothing more than that, a start...


And a co-product with the Belgians? I don't expect so... Or a whole lot will have to change in Belgian Military visions. In my eyes they will probably replace their current second-hand frigates with a few more, but lightly armed offshore patrol vessels, something like the Irish Naval Service.

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Colombamike
Post subject: Re: Dutch Navy unveils M-frigate replacement conceptPosted: November 7th, 2013, 8:07 pm
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MC Spoilt B'stard wrote:
The Dutch navy revealed it's first concept of a new generation of frigates. The ships are replacing the 90s M-frigates in the Dutch navy around 2023. The Dutch navy and Damen Schelde naval shipbuilding are working together in designing and building the ships.
Basic info so-far:
Lenght: +/-145 m
Crew: 120 persons
Weapons:
- 1x76mm cannon
- 16x cells mk-41 VLS (ESSM) possible also SM-2 or other missiles
- 2x 30mm Marlin WS
- 2x Hitrole remote HMG
- 4x Harpoon ASuW missile
- 1x CIWS (unknown system)
Its main role will be ASW there for a hangar and a big flight deck (type 26 style)
under the flight deck a slipway is fitted for FRISC's. Midships there is space for 4 Unmanned Surface Vessels (USV) from this deck the you can also enter the helicopter hangar. The ship will probably not be fitted with a MCM option due to magnetism problems.
The ship will be a co-product with the Belgian navy.
To me it looks like a very cheap concept, somethings look like other ship designs;
- Helicopter deck looks like Type 26 deck
- The bow style looks like me something italian and/or French
I asked the website for more pictures, if i get them i will give it a try to draw this concept, if i dont get them i try to do my best with these 4.
Hmmm,
For a future class of 2 warships around 2022.
I had hoped that the Dutch use a more modern warships design "style".
Your pictures look like "only" same as improved SIGMA style, maybe a 14516 or 14518 type ??? :?
Any full Revolution in the next decade :?


Last edited by Colombamike on November 7th, 2013, 8:43 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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MC Spoilt B'stard
Post subject: Re: Dutch Navy unveils M-frigate replacement conceptPosted: November 7th, 2013, 8:13 pm
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@Colombamike : the 20mm CIWS is not a CIWS, its a current EW system called Sabre, it was used on the LC-Frigattes also.

And it think ( and deeply hope) that the 76mm just was an old model and they couldnt find a new type.

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acelanceloet
Post subject: Re: Dutch Navy unveils M-frigate replacement conceptPosted: November 7th, 2013, 8:13 pm
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the full name of that modern combatand you posted, colombimike, is 'SIGMA Future Combatant' it is thus designed for export, most likely as competitor for other cheap stealth ships.
note that the ship as shown here, if it would have been build, it would have commissioned between 2010 and 2015 most likely, and definitely not later then 2020. also, stealth shapes like that have big disadvantages that you seem to forget

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Vossiej
Post subject: Re: Dutch Navy unveils M-frigate replacement conceptPosted: November 7th, 2013, 8:19 pm
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Those are not CIWS you pointed out Colombamike, but those are Sabre EW systems (http://www.thales7seas.com/html5_beta/product245.html). I believe a Goalkeeper look-a-like is shown on the rear superstructure all the way up.

In a whole, the entire model is rather inaccurate. It shows outdated weapons systems with little to no thought.
Also, the navy has not made any official specifications public, so this design follows more or less the fantasy of the people who made the model.

And final, I don't believe the Dutch will built only two of these ships, they will built at least four. Maybe if the design would become a little bit more international it could serve as an overall M-frigate replacement (think of Chile, Belgium, Portugal,, Bremen class replacement?).

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heuhen
Post subject: Re: Dutch Navy unveils M-frigate replacement conceptPosted: November 7th, 2013, 8:21 pm
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the 76mm I have very often seen naval engineers prefer to use the old 76mm drawing when presenting there drawings. even the first drawing of the Norwegian frigates was armed with the old 76mm, but it also was armed with Bofors 30-40mm gun on the aft deck and had a twin hangar. but all that was fast changed before the second drawing on those frigates come.


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acelanceloet
Post subject: Re: Dutch Navy unveils M-frigate replacement conceptPosted: November 7th, 2013, 8:29 pm
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also, the oto 76 stealth trades a bit of additional weight for a bit of stealth. if your ship is relatively cheap on stealth, it is no use to use an stealth turret, it has only disadvantages then.

btw, I keep looking at these ships and I see no characteristics which are given for the SIGMA ships. Colombimike, please tell me what makes you think it has anything to do with SIGMA except for being dutch?

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MC Spoilt B'stard
Post subject: Re: Dutch Navy unveils M-frigate replacement conceptPosted: November 7th, 2013, 8:41 pm
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The ship is NOT a part of the SIGMA family, its part of the Zeven Provincien / Holland Classes line of designs.
Sigma is not designed to be this big, Sigma's only go till 150 x 15 m, this design is at least 18m wide (16 m is the minimum of operating the NH-90).

I think it will be the basic of a new class of (export) series frigates from Damen Schelde, also for the replacement of the LCF's 2025+

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Colombamike
Post subject: Re: Dutch Navy unveils M-frigate replacement conceptPosted: November 7th, 2013, 8:52 pm
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acelanceloet wrote:
btw, I keep looking at these ships and I see no characteristics which are given for the SIGMA ships. Colombimike, please tell me what makes you think it has anything to do with SIGMA except for being dutch?
:roll:
MC Spoilt B'stard wrote:
[ img ]
[ img ]
:roll:
- Entire bridge forward heavily influenced by the SIGMA
- with only a I-Mast atop
- a open-space amidship for SUV or (cumbersome/ageing/obsolete quadruple canister launchers) SSM
- and a aft superstructure look like a "scaled-down" Zeven Provincien "aft-block" style...


SIGMA 10514
[ img ]


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