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Hood
Post subject: Re: USS Wampanoag (1864)Posted: October 7th, 2013, 12:55 pm
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Looking good. Lovely work on the rigging and sails. It's good to see more of these sailing vessels attempted in SB.
Shading is always a tricky issue, it can look bad and it can look good. Three colours are probably best, or tone the shading down to just 2-pixels wide on the funnels.
Underwater hull shading is quite 'freelance' already on SB, many use three shades and use them to outline the hull shape and others (like me) use the classical way to avoid extra complications. If you're confident in using four shades to represent the underwater hull then feel free to do so.
One issue is the outlining. Some areas of the outline are in black and in others grey. Everything should be outlined in black, I'm sure its just a WIP issue.

I back Ace's comment above, SB is not more restrictive it is as it always was. For many years most if us assumed drawing sailing ships would be impossible at this scale, especially to make them look good. Now we can see artists of talent doing just that.

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CraigH
Post subject: Re: USS Wampanoag (1864)Posted: October 7th, 2013, 1:23 pm
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Thanks all for the comments and suggestions.
I'm trying to reign in the shading to as few shades as I can without loosing the information I'm trying to impart in the drawing. At the same time I'm trying to keep it within the realm of drawings that have been accepted for upload (as in number of shades, if not color).

One more edit session and then it's time for the next one. That 6 Frigate thread got me thinking about the USS Wasp of 1806. Went insane last night and started it in Corel Draw. For some reason it or it's sister the Hornet have been ships I've wanted to model (wood, mixed media) for years. I've plenty of plans and data stashed away suitable for 1/4"=1' or larger. The ship will be on the ragged edge of do-able at SB scale due to size. It would be better in FD Scale...actually all these sailing ships would shine.

Are there any threads regarding or templates for FD ships? I'm not even sure what the scale is! A couple quick searched didn't bring up a lot of easy to find/ hard standards.

CraigH

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darthpanda
Post subject: Re: USS Wampanoag (1864)Posted: October 7th, 2013, 1:59 pm
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Wow mate! Wonderful drawing! Looking forward for your Wasp

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Colosseum
Post subject: Re: USS Wampanoag (1864)Posted: October 7th, 2013, 2:44 pm
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SB scale is "restrictive" for a reason. The original goal of this website was to create a database of ship drawings in the same scale and drawing format - now that has been largely thrown out the window to soothe the egos of some obsessive-compulsive "artists" who feel the need to whine and complain every time they're told to make their drawings match the rest of the stuff on this website. I grow increasingly tired of hearing complaints about the style being "restrictive" - if you have a problem with this, there are plenty of other drawing websites out there that would be happy to have you. Part of the goal of this website is to present a uniform style, something we have slowly lost over the years as we have generally butted heads with the "egos" and continually lost...

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Gollevainen
Post subject: Re: USS Wampanoag (1864)Posted: October 7th, 2013, 4:42 pm
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if you want to present round (perfectly sphere objects like funnels and similar), the actually Rigth way (if you want to follow the logic of SB shading idiomatically) would be like this:
[ img ]

Though, we've accepted ways where you just apply one to three worth of pixels of darker/ligther shade to the rigth edge of the object.

Unfortuanetly the shading in this drawing is beyond the rules, and By such we wouldn't upload it to the bucket.

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Colosseum
Post subject: Re: USS Wampanoag (1864)Posted: October 7th, 2013, 6:30 pm
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I should clarify my comments before I make people unnecessarily angry (they were written in the morning after a weekend of miserable work and frustration for my actual job...)

We all understand that Shipbucket style is not an "artistic" style - it's designed to show many drawings at the same scale and in a similar style that makes drawing with the most rudimentary of tools (MSPaint) easy and rewarding. So, when we see people adding fancy shading and other complications, it goes against what we are attempting to accomplish here. Does that make sense?

In the past, we have actually banned some work from being placed on the archive (Rurik's stuff and Psilander's). I don't think anyone wants to have to keep doing that...

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Garlicdesign
Post subject: Re: USS Wampanoag (1864)Posted: October 7th, 2013, 7:27 pm
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Hello everyone!

For what my opinion is worth: As someone who customarily uses three shades for the underwater hull (in good faith that would be OK because I never had any troubles getting my drawings uploaded) I can only say you managed a fantastic drawing. I would upload it in a heartbeat if I had any say on that matter.

Thank god I haven't though, saves lots of trouble...

Greetings
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WWII44
Post subject: Re: USS Wampanoag (1864)Posted: October 7th, 2013, 8:01 pm
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you do a lot better at drawing ships with sailing masts than I ever will.


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CraigH
Post subject: Re: USS Wampanoag (1864)Posted: October 8th, 2013, 5:19 am
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[ img ]
USS Wampanoag: Version 523.332
Commerce Destroyer designed for a fight with England that didn't happen, and a political hot potato that turned the US Naval establishment on it's head. Designed for speed and steaming endurance at all costs, but hated by the cruising navy who condemned her for being over engined, and with insufficient stowage. That damned engine and coal took up too much space they wanted for silly things like grog and food. Finally, it held the sustained speed record for about 20 years....
OK, here's what's done:

Sails: 4 colors used. One happens to be a rigging color. There are a number of 4 color sails existing in the ACCEPTED and Uploaded SB archive as precedent. I'd work with that as a maximum allowable standard any day...one can do a LOT with 4 well chosen colors.
Basically in this case:
1 Sail color.
2 Sail shadow and light seam color.
3 Dark seam color.
4 Sail edge color.
Note that Reefing lines are now one of the rigging colors, may as well be the dark seam color.

Smokestacks: Modified to adhere to Gollevainen's example. A huge thank you for that image.

Upper Hull: Now 3 major colors (primary hull color, 2 shadow colors, one shadow color doubles for plank seams and upper hull trim shadow). Eliminated 1 major shadow shade. Also eliminated an additional deep shadow gray that was used to pop the upper trim. Also eliminated a tan shade used to help pop the hammock rail.

Lower Hull: Down to 3 major colors (Loss of 1) plus a toned down line to define the keel.
Again, there's accepted SB precedent.

Odds and Ends: Wiped out some vestigial graded shading I found on the vents between the stacks. Fixed some deep gray line-work to proper black.

Thanks to everyone for the complements. I've retained/archived most of the checkpoint drawings.
Keep in mind that I'm interested in learning the SB standards...or at least create drawings that will get accepted. If I can stretch "da rules" a bit, even better. Hopefully we all can benefit in some way.

CraigH

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Lazer_one
Post subject: Re: USS Wampanoag (1864)Posted: October 8th, 2013, 6:10 am
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you did a great work.
Just a small comment about the funnels: I would prefer all four funnels with the shadow looking forward.

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