| erik_t wrote: |
This was extensively studied in the 1950s. Googling "polaris mlf" should get you on your way.
And having done so here is one image, one can find there![[ img ]](http://i288.photobucket.com/albums/ll181/MCSpoiltBstard/US_MLF_programe.png)
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| Polaris on merchant ships? http://67.205.157.234/forums/viewtopic.php?f=3&t=7015 |
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| Author: | Obsydian Shade [ June 7th, 2016, 7:02 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Polaris on merchant ships? |
I'm not saying this idea was great--it isn't, compared to locating them on SSBNs, but it occured to me, what if the idea of doing that with a few vessels isn't to create any viable deterrant, as to drive your enemy f-ing nuts with having to potentially track and tag every sodding merchant vessel? The actual ships don't even need to carry missiles, at least not all of them, but this seems like an excellent way to get your adversary to spend far more money trying to constantly track and locate the real vessels, than you did with the conversions, or probably fake conversions in many instances, as you play a shell game that involves constantly switching (or appearing to) the empty vessels with the loaded ones. Hell, the missiles you stick in most of them can be cardboard, and it would be enough to fool spy satellites of the time. |
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| Author: | heuhen [ June 7th, 2016, 8:37 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Polaris on merchant ships? |
well Russian have an container based missile systems... in Normal merchant container..... ehhh |
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| Author: | erik_t [ June 7th, 2016, 10:06 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Polaris on merchant ships? |
This was extensively studied in the 1950s. Googling "polaris mlf" should get you on your way. |
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| Author: | Obsydian Shade [ June 8th, 2016, 12:07 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Polaris on merchant ships? |
I'm aware of the real issues with MLF, but again, my desire isn't so much to create any sort of effective deterrent, as it is to make the enemy waste all sorts of resources trying to keep track of a largely bogus threat, with just enough reality behind it, that it can't really be dismissed. I'm just wondering how effective this plan might really be? The idea would be to use something like Liberty/Victory ships, or some rather common merchant vessel design to facilitate this. |
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| Author: | deankal55 [ June 8th, 2016, 12:09 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Polaris on merchant ships? |
Check out the USNS Observation Island, the Polaris missile test ship converted from a Mariner Class cargo ship. |
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| Author: | eswube [ June 8th, 2016, 5:10 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Polaris on merchant ships? |
Although not with Polaris, I recall reading somewhere that North Koreans might have got that idea (or that US intelligence services were afraid that they may got that idea), only rather with some Scud derivative, that could be potentially used to attack continental USA. |
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| Author: | Novice [ June 8th, 2016, 9:12 pm ] | |
| Post subject: | Re: Polaris on merchant ships? | |
This was extensively studied in the 1950s. Googling "polaris mlf" should get you on your way.
And having done so here is one image, one can find there
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| Author: | citizen lambda [ June 10th, 2016, 7:58 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Polaris on merchant ships? |
Re. Soviet equivalent, Alexey Sokolov mentions a so-called "Skorpion" project in the early 60s to launch D-9 SLBMs from converted arctic cargo ships from Project 505. The intention is clearly mentioned to camouflage these ships as civilian shipping or auxiliary vessels. Two designs were studies, as Projects 909 and 1111. ![[ img ]](http://alternathistory.com/files/resize/users/user3136/otvaga2004_scorpion-03-680x319.jpg) ![[ img ]](http://alternathistory.com/files/resize/users/user3136/otvaga2004_scorpion-05-680x458.jpg) Naturally, none left the drawing board. After the first Polaris SSBNs entered USN service, the D-9 missiles found their way onto the Project 667B (Delta-1) conventional SSBNs and the complete Skorpioncproject would be considered redundant. More info on the project (in Russian) here. Also in another style, remember that the Italian Navy was well on its way to refit the pre-war cruiser Guiseppe Garibaldi with Polaris missiles, before their whole nuclear deterrence went south. |
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| Author: | odysseus1980 [ June 10th, 2016, 10:00 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Polaris on merchant ships? |
Model of Guiseppe Garibaldi: http://www.steelnavy.com/RM%20Garibaldi.htm |
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| Author: | Hood [ June 11th, 2016, 8:24 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Polaris on merchant ships? |
Very interesting details for the Pr.909 and Pr.1111, I hadn't realised what their precise role was. |
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