Shipbucket

So I find shipbucket to be a bit time consuming to try making good concepts with. I dont want to just take other peoples stuff and miss-mash it together just so I can come up with some quick and dirty ideas. So I make use sometimes of adobe illustrator to make simple line drawing. I feel its good for visual learners like myself to set ideas in stone.

So here is a concept I came up with for a battleship. Its a late WW2 era ship for a country with a vast coastline in need of defense. Lacking the industry to produce large number of fast-battleships, instead this naval power has chosen to build larger numbers of forward-weapon armed vessels that emphasize speed over firepower without making the drastic cuts to armor that would typically be seen in a battlecruiser. It is also meant to be produced in large numbers, coming it around 32k tons fully loaded. Its long hull is meant to augment speed, but its armor scheme is very concentrated, similar to a Nelson class layout.

So far it is armed with six 16" guns and thirty 5" DP guns. Part of its weight savings come from a lack of large 8" secondaries and AA emphasis.

what you have there is:

They're not exactly the same (such as the placement of the secondary mounts) but of course you can kitbash the drawing.

I like the idea or line drawings to layout ships,

as to your design,

- I would cut some DP guns maybe I think 12xtwins is fine and cut centre line guns (or cut top bow super firing and 4 raised side guns ?)
- Add light AA ?
- how are you BRs/ER laid out re the funnel/shaft placement ?

Hi Krases,

It's a good drawing, however, I worry that you'd be vulnerable to lighter ships, particularly cruisers - if they chose to stay out of 5" range (anybody who's aware of your ship spec will make that choice!) you're left engaging fairly small, quite fast targets with 6x16", not something I'd be confident of getting hits with. If those ships (probably 6"-armed light cruisers) are themselves firing on you, you're going to be taking damage without much possibility of scoring hits in return, if they're armed with torpedoes you could be in a world of trouble.

Note that this may well be a decision you've already thought about and accepted (how much of a danger that is really depends on your screening forces), however, as I understand it, masses of torpedo boats may be a better fit for the scenario you've described (unless the true scenario is "I want to draw a battleship!", which is fine! )

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I'm not sure id worry about a CL assuming its not a secondary target, 6 16" guns should demolish it. My worry would be you cant split effective if facing 2 CLs but you should kill the first one fast so should be ok (as long as you don't meet fast BB and 8" companion without help but that's why you build more than 1 of of them)

I don't understand, What fast BB had 8" guns ?

Hey JSB,

My worry was that as described I figured they'd be operating either without or with a comparatively light screen - and you're right, by the way, a 16" shell hit would destroy or cripple a light cruiser ... if it hit. A six-gun main battery is a little light, I'd thought, especially for operation in a detached role.

As a for instance, suppose this is facing off against a lone Agano. If this battleship opens fire at maximum range, 38,000m (assuming a similar range to US 16" Mk.7 guns), it'll have almost 15 minutes to fire 29 salvos at the Agano before it reaches the 22,000m standard firing range of the carried Type 93 Long Lance torpedoes, or 174 shells. The maths on this one probably work out in favour of the battleship, unless it has truly horrendous accuracy. But what if it's two Agano, what if the Aganos fire their torpedoes at maximum range, what if they don't get picked up at 38km? Any of these things start happening and it's looking a bit more dicey for this battleship. Given the usage description, that was my concern.

By the way, in a similar example for an Iowa, you're looking at 29 9-shell salvos, so 261 shells fired at the target. Even assuming 1% accuracy that's still a fair safety margin.

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EDIT:To simplify the problem I've assumed that whoever is sending the Agano is willing to lose it and that the torpedo launches just work and sink the ship. Not terribly realistic, it's because I didn't want to go into the whole IJN torpedo accuracy thing for a sample post.

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If you are opening fire at 38,000 I assume its daylight and not sure that any surface LL attack will be effective at long range unless you are talking massive numbers at a fleet of ships?

I would add why not add another turret ? It will not add much to cost (and you are making lots anyway ?) unless you are size limited it doesn't make sense IMO ? Its late war so no treaty's are you dock size limited or a canal ?

Thanks for all the replies!

The justification for this ship is this:

While a large USS Montana sized ship could be built, a Montana cannot be in two places at once. As such, it is considered better to have two lesser hulls instead of one great hull so as to have more naval presence in more areas. However, to augment the problems this creates, a number of adjustments are made to the doctrines used by the Navy.

The main doctrine change is extended use of land based air support. The skill, training and investment is not there at the time these ships are needed for a major investment to be made in carriers. The type of distances involved when it comes to this ships patrol range and its proximity to land based air support greatly negates enemy carriers, which at this stage of the war have taken major losses. Carriers are being developed, but the wars focus means that they are not being being focused upon strongly.

Armor has not been heavily sacrificed in this design, firepower has been. The ship still maintains good speed and its armor scheme is heavily concentrated around the two front turrets and engines. The ship cannot have its T crossed, as doing so allows the ship to angles its armor for maximum thickness while still maintain full firepower. The ship is well equipped to charge an enemy vessel head on, angling its armor as it moves. During a retreat phase, the ship relies on its great quantity of 5" guns, smoke from escorts and land based air support to cover itself. The ships also work very well in groups, as treating naval forces as a unit and not as single ships was another doctrine change brought about by developments in communication and training.

The navy this ship belongs to had fairly modern cruisers at the start of the war. Light cruisers were about the only ship it had in decent quantity and with fairly modern designs. Heavy cruisers were available in smaller numbers and with less quality with capital ships being even fewer in number and even less advanced.

There are battlecruisers, standard battleships, pocket battleships and fast battleships. For my own AU, I am creating this class as a "Maneuver battleship", as it has qualities of a fast battleship and a pocket battleship

I also have another design. Similar, with 22, 5" guns and one large quad 16" turret. This one leans even stronger towards being a pocket battleship.

Time for even more line drawings. First a cruiser, basically an Atlanta, but with slightly fewer guns. In my AU, I play to have something akin to a 40mm bofors, but instead in 60mm between a 40mm and a 3" AA gun used by the US late in the war. That would stand in place of the side turrets on my Atlanta type AAA ship.



Secondly, we have a true full battleship version of my first battleships. 12x 500mm guns in quad turrets. Pretty heavy. Also has 44 5" guns in the first version and 54 in the second version. Not pictured are my indigenous 60mm, 30mm and 15 mm guns. Also not pictured is the small compliment of aerodynamic seaplanes I previously designed.





Edit: Here is a previous post describing my weaponry.
Here is a previous post on my aerodynamic seaplanes.