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Newbie Incoming!
http://67.205.157.234/forums/viewtopic.php?f=18&t=872		 Page 1 of 3
Author:  JjeeporCreepor [ March 5th, 2011, 5:08 am ]
Post subject:  Newbie Incoming!
Hello all. Longtime fiddler with MS Paint even now that I've finally got GIMP. I've been lurking around here for a bit (came via the Alternate History Discussion Board) and thought now was the time to stick my head above the parapet and present my first Shipbucket effort for your consideration. Hope it isn't too rubbish.

It's some kind of weird, probably militarily useless, VSTOL/helicopter carrier based on a container ship hull, fitted with modular hangars, weapons systems etc based on standard shipping containers. There were real life efforts to do this, of course, such as Arapaho and SCADS, but my inspiration for doing this came from rereading the book The Third World War by General Sir John Hackett "and Others", where "escort carriers" like this are part of the book's NATO rearmament effort that allows them eventually to win said war.

Air wing is half a dozen aircraft, a mix of ASW helicopters and Harriers depending on mission - there's a ski-jump for the latter behind the forward hangar on the other side of the ship. They could probably ship a far larger number on deck, but that's all they have hangar space for.

The ship outline itself is mainly based on the ill-fated container ship Atlantic Conveyor which acted as a transport for Harriers and helicopters in the Falklands War before being sunk by missile attack. I have credited MihoshiK as I used quite a lot of the details from his drawings of HMS Invincible as a guide - radars, boats, aircraft, etc. Most of the hull and core superstructure and the big ugly pile of containers are mine, but I didn't want to go using people's parts without giving due credit.

Anyway, there she is...

[Edited - deleted attachment and added image from Photobucket instead]

[ img ]
Author:  Lazer_one [ March 5th, 2011, 8:23 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Newbie Incoming!
It's a good start and I would have some comments to improve the drawing:
The propeller looks strange... It is the propeller for azipod
The containers are ready in the part sheet
Please highlight the sealevel with a black line (inside the dark grey)
Moreover I would suggest to add the other hull signals like the Plimson's eye, the bulb signal, ...
The hull door should be outlined by black color
Author:  Novice [ March 5th, 2011, 10:09 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Newbie Incoming!
Welcome aboard, and nice drawing as regards the technique.
And now for some points to consider, apart from Lazer_One's points
First the radars are wrong for yoour ship: If you use Sea Wolf you need the correct search and guidance radars, and you have radars which go with Sea Dart. Sea Wolf has Types 977/978 combination for search and Type 910 for guidance (all radars can be found in the Parts Sheet thread by Hood or the Type 22 frigates in the Real Designs thread)
Also I don't think a ship like that will have sonar, she is part of a task group/escort group, and submarine detection is done by the frigates or helicopters (it also says so in book you mention, excellent read by the way).
Author:  Hood [ March 5th, 2011, 10:23 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Newbie Incoming!
Welcome.

A very interesting idea, the book is a great read as is the follow-on book as well, and one that I've often thought about.

The style points raised by Lazer and Novice need looking at and cover everything I can think of. I would ditch the Type 1022 radar though as the ship doesn't really need a long-range set as she'll get data from her escorts. There is I think a container based Sea Wolf launcher and 910 radar on a parts sheet. You'll find newer and better Harriers and Sea Kings in the planebucket thread too. Overall in terms of looks and execution this is a fine effort and I like her very much.

Interestingly as a side-line D.K. Brown noted that fitting Arapaho took almost as much time and effort as it would to convert a civilian ship into a proper permanent carrier and doubted its overall utility to save time and money.
Author:  Bombhead [ March 5th, 2011, 10:30 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Newbie Incoming!
A very creditable 1ST drawing.Keep going. ;)
Author:  Thiel [ March 5th, 2011, 2:17 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Newbie Incoming!
Also, for a containership it has a very large superstructure.
Author:  Hood [ March 5th, 2011, 3:21 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Newbie Incoming!
If I remember rightly the ships in the book were purpose-built rather than converted civilian ships. They could have a peacetime role of transporting RN goods and spares acorss the world in containers or use as troopships etc. Maybe even as bulk oil tankers (not AOR).
Author:  Bombhead [ March 5th, 2011, 4:56 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Newbie Incoming!
Better aircraft ;) Curtesy of DP and Paul 541.
[ img ]

[ img ]
Author:  Portsmouth Bill [ March 5th, 2011, 6:31 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Newbie Incoming!
Yes, a very interesting drawing, and you seem to be on the right track - just need to heed the advice above. Re crediting, do not credit another artist if all you are doing is using parts; we only share credits when you've worked over another drawing where the original is predominant.
Author:  Thiel [ March 5th, 2011, 6:48 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Newbie Incoming!
One thing you might consider is to move the superstructure further aft and loose the stern landing pad. AFAIK midship landings are easier to do anyway, and what you loose aft you get in front.
You should also consider a raised forecastle and a breakwater so you don't loose all your containers in heavy weather.
Hood wrote:
Interestingly as a side-line D.K. Brown noted that fitting Arapaho took almost as much time and effort as it would to convert a civilian ship into a proper permanent carrier and doubted its overall utility to save time and money.
Presumably these ships would be designed to take an equivalent system from the outset.
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