Shipbucket
http://67.205.157.234/forums/

Dutch battlecruiser (AU)
http://67.205.157.234/forums/viewtopic.php?f=18&t=5770		 Page 1 of 2
Author:  StealthJester [ December 22nd, 2014, 2:43 am ]
Post subject:  Dutch battlecruiser (AU)
https://www.dropbox.com/s/puqqnnh7n5pn7 ... 5.PNG?dl=0

This is my first posting to Shipbucket. The Reinier Claeszen class is from my AU where the United Kingdom of the Netherlands survives into the 20th Century.

Based on a sketch of the Germania Werft Project 743 design with more powerful engines (25 knots) and heavier armor. Retained the eight 343mm guns (4 x 2) as main armament.

Image URL above - did not appear to upload correctly. Any assistance on uploading via Dropbox would be greatly appreciated.

Cheers!
StealthJester
Author:  TimothyC [ December 22nd, 2014, 3:07 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Dutch battlecruiser (AU)
StealthJester wrote:
https://www.dropbox.com/s/puqqnnh7n5pn7 ... 5.PNG?dl=0

This is my first posting to Shipbucket. The Reinier Claeszen class is from my AU where the United Kingdom of the Netherlands survives into the 20th Century.

Based on a sketch of the Germania Werft Project 743 design with more powerful engines (25 knots) and heavier armor. Retained the eight 343mm guns (4 x 2) as main armament.

Image URL above - did not appear to upload correctly. Any assistance on uploading via Dropbox would be greatly appreciated.

Cheers!
StealthJester
Change the dl=0 to dl=1, and stick it in the IMG tags.

[ img ]

Welcome aboard
Author:  Krakatoa [ December 22nd, 2014, 4:13 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Dutch battlecruiser (AU)
Replace - http://www.dropbox.com - with - dl.dropboxusercontent.com and the image will show. you can also remove the last 5 number/letter combination after the drawings *.png file extension.

Welcome to Shipbucket. A good start with a good looking ship.

An interesting design, the ship would be completed after Derfflinger which had superfiring 12", while this design is more like the Von Der Tann with the bigger guns. Which asks the question, "would Germany have proposed a design that was not as good as those they were already building?" I note you give the completion? date as 1915. Do you have a date for the original design plans?
Author:  JSB [ December 22nd, 2014, 4:46 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Dutch battlecruiser (AU)
Welcome and looks nice
Author:  Hood [ December 22nd, 2014, 8:47 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Dutch battlecruiser (AU)
Welcome aboard, that's a very nice first drawing.
I quite like the layout and the armament, looks a decent ship. I guess slip and drydock availability is going to restrict the length of the vessel and might prevent superfiring turrets from being used.
Author:  Tempest [ December 22nd, 2014, 10:43 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Dutch battlecruiser (AU)
Hello, and welcome. A very nice start to Shipbucket.
Author:  eswube [ December 22nd, 2014, 7:05 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Dutch battlecruiser (AU)
Welcome to the Shipbucket! Nice start indeed!
Author:  StealthJester [ December 23rd, 2014, 12:00 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Dutch battlecruiser (AU)
Thank you all for your welcomes and feedback.

I would like, and eventually intend, to post this ship (and others from the same AU) on the Alternate Universe forum with additional information and histories.

For now I'd thought I'd address the questions posed.

The original Project 743 design dates from September of 1912 (in our timeline). In my timeline, the United Netherlands has been trying (mostly successfully) to "keep up" with naval developments. The Reinier Claeszen class was their first modern capital ships and were intended as counters to Japanese expansion in the Far East (particularly the Kongo class).
They were designed about the same time as the Moltke and Seydlitz classes and share some design features. In addition, the class ship was built by Blohm und Voss in Hamburg, while her three sisterships were built by Dutch yards (which necessitated the smaller overall dimensions due to restrictions in the slipways and drydocks).

Cheers!
StealthJester
Author:  Krakatoa [ December 23rd, 2014, 1:21 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Dutch battlecruiser (AU)
Well done StealthJester.

I like your ship and the Dutch AU theme is always a good one, requiring ships that can be used both home and abroad.

Your ship is armed with 343mm (13.5") which is not a common size for the Germans but is for the British. While stocks of shells would be held at home and in the Indies, would the guns also be able to use the British 13.5" shells which would give a much more flexible replenishment source in time of war?

The Kongos (laid down 1911), being bigger, faster and with bigger, longer ranged guns, could choose the range to their advantage. Would it be worthwhile building four ships when the details of Kongo became available, rather than building two pairs. First pair being the ship you have, while the second pair would be more advanced and have an advantage over Kongo? With your ships being laid down in 1912, would they have kept with the 343mm knowing Kongos guns were already bigger? Going to either the German 350mm or the same 14" UK or even the US 14" as per the Salamis.

The time lapse between pairs would also give you time to enhance some of your dockyards and infrastructure to build/service the bigger ships.

Just some thoughts - the ships and stories are yours after all. It just strikes me as unusual that if you are building ships to compete with Kongo that you do not give them an advantage of some kind.
Author:  StealthJester [ December 23rd, 2014, 1:38 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Dutch battlecruiser (AU)
Definitely food for thought…

Your thought on using the UK 343mm shell is a good one and in fact the original draft of my AU had the British selling the Orion class to the Dutch (my Washington Naval Treaty does not prohibit sales of ships to other nations).
But thanks to overzealous French troops violating neutral Netherlands territory trying to outflank the Germans after the outbreak of the Great War (OTL's WWI) the Dutch side with the Central Powers.

These ships were undergunned and underarmored compared to the Kongo's which is why the next class were true battleships armed with 356mm (14") weapons, larger, and more heavily armored.

The Reinier Claeszen class was not considered a success in the long run and were disposed of under the Washington Naval Treaty (my treaty included the US, UK, Japan, Germany, France, the United Netherlands, Italy, and Austria-Hungary as signatory nations).

StealthJester
Page 1 of 2 All times are UTC
Powered by phpBB® Forum Software © phpBB Limited
https://www.phpbb.com/