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As said above, the Lambro Olympic D44/D45 series.

First vessels built under lisence in 1967 and production continued for many years. Later vessels built on this hul are the D50/D54 and the D65/D74, with the number is LOA in feet. Some of the smaller are in use in large lakes, while other in sea. The larger hulls are pilot boats and workboats, even a small fire boat was developed on the D65/D74 hull. Most amblulances are of D45 type, while some larger D54 also exist. Most vessels use various Volvo Penta engines, with speeds from 18kn to 24kn. Among hulls built were leisure crafts with several different superstructures. Finally, a handful of lake cruisers built on D65/D74 hull.

I am not sure about the underwater hull of a Nelson/Halmatic.

does the ambulance version have a smaller engine? otherwise you have structure build on top of the engine hatches.

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that is no problem ace...

you only need an small hatch to get down to the engine anyway. if the hull is build like Viksund in Norway is building them, then the engine can be placed extreme far aft.... What Viksund do is that they use the same hull as they use on a stern drive hull, and just cut out a bit of the hull for giving space for the propeller, it's almost like a water-jet configuration... the advantage is you get a better hull speed, and economic speed, and also stability at speed.

but the Normal thing is to have the engine placed under the superstructure and have access hatches both in the cabin and out on the deck. If you need to remove the engine they just pull it backwards, by adding a pulley that are connecting to the crane...

The other way is a having the engine above it's own propeller, and have the shaft go to an V-gear...


I see if I can find some examples, since it looks like you never have seen how small boats have there engines placed...

yep, but if that is the case it would be much simpler for all versions to have the larger cabin. on ships like these, the engine hatch also serves as engine removal hatch, so you can effectively rebuild the ship without cutting steel.

I have seen how small boats have the engines and propulsion placed, heuhen, no need to search for examples.

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and why do they need to be build out of steel, why not GRP.

You don't need to rebuild anything, does he writing that the ship was rebuild.

(I am talking now out of those two years of experience I have on this, from both world in GRP and steal..., and alwo working/learning together with the designer of Viksund boats... a good friend of me! no joke!)

GRP boats. There is many ways to build a boat with different superstructure (when a GRP boats is cast, it often have a: hull cast, "Some" have an engine room cast, interior cast, deck cast and superstructure cast. some companys like to have only a hull and a deck-superstructure cast to save money.). ther are many ways so:

version 1. have different cast. for different superstructure. (cost a bit more, but give higher quality)
version 2. have an add on cast. (this give the advantage to form the boats just how the customer want it) Gulf Craft from Saudi Arabia lows this technique, and use it on all there ships, in fct if you boy an 70 feet yacht, they just use the same cast as they use when they build a 50 feet yacht, but they add some extra parts to the cast making it bigger...
version 3. I cant remember it, but it is an more know how technique with a bit of mad man design in to it!

we have rescue vessel in Norway that have there engine placed under the superstructure, and the company that got the order to replace those engines, just cut open the hull bellow waterline and pulled the engine out with an forklift... repairing that type of cutout is often fast and if done correct, as strong as original.

Steal, where I worked we had many different ways to do things:

Version 1. often used have a full scale template of every steal parts needed. (often used)
Version 2. often used with enlarging superstructure after an design, by having a template that you can place next to the original template...

just for the heck of it!:
http://www.boatdesign.net/gallery/data/500/514.jpg

oh on this one the engine is placed as far aft as possible, just enough space between ruder machine and engine for an mechanic to move around, the gear is placed to the front of the engine pointing toward the bow, some are again mounted to a V-gear, sending all the power to a shaft going under the engine.
http://www.boatdesign.net/gallery/data/ ... 0sj_op.JPG


So I don't see that problem you are talking about, what those vessels are, is just normal business her in Norway... but it might be that we have better engineers her in Norway knowing all the tricks in the books, and those that are not written in books.... (nah, it is all to experience, I have experience more toward small craft, pleasure craft and yacht, since I know personally and have worked with the boos of Viksund yacht of Norway that also build fishing boats, and small fast boats for the Navy. and also trough him got to know and learned some small things about getting ideas down on the paper by there house designer. basically I had some lucky years, but have now come to the other side of the apple, and making wooden parts for furniture, instead of designing yacht... the world is F***)

grp on workboats, which often come alongside with bumbs and all? bad idea.

that said, GRP is even harder to remodel when modified. also, we are speaking here about odysseus1980's vessels, which are 1. not designed as yachts. 2. have the engines forward, as shown by the actual casing for them.

so, all you say after that is about yachts, especially of the type viksund builds, which are quite unlike these vessels. most of what you say, even if true, is unrelated.

and yeah, all is better in norway and all of the world is still in the boat stone age. their ships go faster, work better they float in the sky and go supersonic! and also they are invisible. that is why nobody else can understand how they work.
heuhen, you don't have to learn me stuff I already know, especially as I can often pick the mistakes out of what you tell me easily. because even an norwegian mad viking doesn't know everything better then the rest of the world, and pretending to do so can piss people off

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Drawings are credited with J.Scholtens
I ask of you to prove me wrong. Not say I am wrong, but prove it, because then I will have learned something new.
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GRP survive bumping into thing far better than aluminium... 40 year old fishing boats up to 80 feets size here in Norway is proof of that... and even I have driven an GRP boat directly in to rocks at 20 knots, only damage was paint damage, and my pride.... all aluminium boats I have seen, get massive hull and sink.... so give me an good example why GRP is supposed to be weaker than aluminium.
Non of odysseus vessels are modifications, they are build from start to be like that. but hard to remodel a GRP boat... well this is word out from an person that know nothing about GRP (something you just show me now, one thing is to have education, but experience..... is far mush heavier than education, always). to modify an GRP hull is the easiest thing you can ever do, even a person with just basic knowledge can do that. I'll give you an example:

Lengthening a GRP hull (because it's one of the hardest things to get correct), I'll write it up in how it should be done:

1. clean the hull (must be spot free) (Aluminium vessel the same thing)
2. build an cast on that part of the hull you want lengthen at. (aluminium boats: doing measures and and cut the hull)
3. cast a new hull section in the cast that was made. and cut the hull in half while the cast is setting it self. (Aluminium: making all the ribs needed.)
4. place the new hull section in between the two hull half. (aluminium: placing out the ribs and start marking and measuring up the placement of each single ribs. a slow process)
5. Grinding the hull side, so you get an angled surface in the contact area between both hull, this is what making it strong. ( starting to get finish with measuring up where all new hull ribs shall be
6. (There is two ways to do it, I prefer this way, because it easier to do) In the area you need to cast the two hull together, add an smooth surfaced plate on the outside, and partially cover the other side with plastic fabric to the hull, and connect the vacuum system to it so it is ready. (Aluminium: ready to weld all ribs and the hull it self)
7. a combination of spraying GRP and placing GRP-mats, and close it all in under the plastic fabric. and start the vacum pump to get out all the air. (Aluminium hull still welding, ups this one I have to do again weld!)
8. hull finish cast, just need some painting and connecting new cables.... (aluminium hull still working on the welding, somethimes you need three layer of weld, and the you need to smoothen the surface other places...)
9. GRP boat on water. the Aluminium boat is still being worked on.




In fact you are wrong again, Viksund delivered 500 work boats to the Norwegian Navy, like this one for exampel. notice how similar this one is to odysseus1980's...:

It's an 89 model (one of the last on in the series), it have been use to tow targets, it have been used as target, it have done all the dirty work, and still is intact. the only thing that keep bracking down on here is here engines! LOL
PDF on that boat, it's in Norwegian but it show 3-4 variant of the vessel on the same hull (3 different superstructure where 2 of them is just an enlarged superstructure of that one in the picture above)
http://www.viksundboats.no/uploads/prod ... /v1100.pdf
It also piss people of when an socald engineer going around beliving that a GRP boat can withstand anything, is hard to modify etc. when it is the opposite. we In Norway have done some crazy things up trough the years, and learned from them, we also have that bloody North sea to test things in.... could Norway have been placed somewhere with better weather.

leisure craft and lake cruiser is an another way of saying yacht!.......

only thing I have on his ...work-boats/yacht is that they are supposed to be build in 1967, boats with that type of design language come first in the start of the 80's. Viksund was out in 83, Azimut in 77



if we going totally nasty on GRP then we can start to talk about laminated GRP and sandwiched GRP.... and one of them can withstand gunfire..... that's fun. In fact a new thing here in Norway the small boats company's compete in how can build the strongest boat. and during the last 4 years some of them have used an special sort of strengthened Laminated GRP construction, making the vessel bulletproof up to 12'7mm guns! (Why the hell shall an private person need that), even the windows is bulletproof, oh some of them can turn it self around if it capsize... Norwegian you so silly! "When are we going to drive a boat in to a war-zone and capsize the boat!?!"

These "lake cruisers" are not yachts, but actually fresh water passenger vessels . Leisure crafts in lakes of HLK is not very common, for the simple reason that most boaters prefer sea. There are some popular beaches in lakes and large rivers however. Anyone can do everything, as long as do not harm the ecosystem. Water sports ( skiing, sailing, canoying, rowing, windsurfing, kitesurfing) are generally available, but not everywhere.

Fresh water crafts generally have smaller engines (except police vessels). For instance, a Lambro 43 water taxi (completely different design from above Nelson/Halmatic) have 240hp instead of 600+hp, giving about 12-14 kn.

Lambro Olympic 43 Water Taxi (as I recall from some years ago, in Pamvotis lake of Ioannina)



A lake cruise boat (from same lake)

actually, heuhen.....
have you ever seen a grp boat which bow was repaired with a strip of aluminium? because, you know, you can epoxy a piece of aluminium over it to repair the lost strength? of course, grp is just as strong as aluminium, and steel, when constructed right. but when damaged, it is quite hard to repair. similarly, modifying an grp boat is quite a lot harder then the ones made of metal. also, grp is, at this time, more expensive then steel (aluminium was IIRC also cheaper then grp but I am not certain about that) so why would they use it, for 'just a workboat'

reread my post, designed not as yachts. if these boats were designed as yachts, and then remodelled to other tasks, then your post would make sense. right now, it does not.

as per lengthening a grp boat, you completely miss anything about getting the laminates match up, let them run over in each other, the strength....... al the designers problems, and the accuracy of getting that right on the workfloor. that is what makes it hard, not the method of constructing it.

if norway does everything better, why aren't all ships build in norway these days? oh right. because there are more ways then one to get working ships.

and now this discussion is closed.

_________________
Drawings are credited with J.Scholtens
I ask of you to prove me wrong. Not say I am wrong, but prove it, because then I will have learned something new.
Shipbucket Wiki admin

the reason hips is not build in Norway is that we are so bloody expensive. a single worker get pay every thing from the double to the triple of any other workers in the World! it' sad.

of course you can take the cast and move it in to that area you want to extende the vessel and mold it directly in there... perhaps also the best solution. but there are at list 100's ways to do things.

repairing a bow, Viksund had one in last year, where they just cut of the bow, and used there own mold for an different vessel that have similar shape to create a new bow... it's all about getting it glued together some are a bit... hard. I did it once... if I remember correct we had to do it two times because the first time it got a bit wrong!