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The Alternative Postwar Royal Navy http://67.205.157.234/forums/viewtopic.php?f=14&t=1088 |
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Author: | erik_t [ May 17th, 2011, 1:03 am ] | |
Post subject: | Re: The Alternative Postwar Royal Navy | |
That's a fair point Erik. Sea Cat is intended to replace the 40mm Bofors, in its earlier MRS-3 guided form its no anti-missile missile. It does well at close-in AA work but its subsonic. Orange Nell is not an area-defence weapon, that role is for Sea Slug, Orange Nell is designed as an anti-missile system. In effect the Type 80 is a goalie. Now I could have made her a double-ender and put a second Nell aft instead of the flightdeck but that would have meant losing the Wasp and possibly Limbo. I wanted the Type 80 to have an ASW escort role too, she meant to be a Type 12 with the 4.5in replaced by a missile system as the Admiralty intended doing. She is a goalie protecting the carrier with the County or Admiral (both of which also have Nell) further out for area defence. I figure the vertical 40-round magazine would be pretty bulky and would require a lot of internal space.
I don't mean to suggest a second Orange Nell - rather, nothing at all. Or perhaps keep the 40mm right through the Sea Cat era. Even this scenario surely involves economies, and including a second system that effectively duplicates a subset of the first, while adding a (granted, small) additional chain of spare parts and trained crews... it just doesn't make sense to me. Certainly one never saw Sea Sparrow appear on Tartar ships. It'd be nice if money grew on trees, but I'd rather spend that cash getting more Orange Nell into the fleet (even if on different ships).
And because Sea Cat is light it makes sense to fit it to make a double-ender ship without the loss of capablity and gorwth in hull size and weight two Nells would require. Like everything, you have to compromise somewhere. |
Author: | Portsmouth Bill [ May 19th, 2011, 7:42 am ] |
Post subject: | Re: The Alternative Postwar Royal Navy |
Another 'fill in' from the same period as the 'A' cruisers. The Towns built pre war were by that virtue able to offer extended service in the 1950's. The modernisations did vary from ship to ship, but two, the Newcastle and Birmingham were updated along the same lines - the bridge remodelled, but not fully enclosed, air conditioning, and the usual postwar sensor fit. My Newcastle is based on Hoods excellent original, then, while still in progress for 'real life' Hood shared with me some ideas of his own for the AU version of the class, so I've also cribbed some of them. Of note is that I'm showing fully inflatable liferafts of an earlier type, and I don't see why these should not have been in service by 1950, given a more enlightened view os crew safety! ![]() I am considering the torpedo tubes; should we go for an exchange at some time to Bidder or Fancy? if the former I'd need to factor in sonar so together we have asw self defence; otherwise we have escorts to provide asw. And Fancy offers anti-ship capability. |
Author: | KimWerner [ May 19th, 2011, 8:20 am ] |
Post subject: | Re: The Alternative Postwar Royal Navy |
I'm not skilled enough to debate the weapons technicality, but I love the look of these early life rafts and may compliment the beautiful drawing. That's really nice ![]() |
Author: | Thiel [ May 19th, 2011, 8:33 am ] | |
Post subject: | Re: The Alternative Postwar Royal Navy | |
I am considering the torpedo tubes; should we go for an exchange at some time to Bidder or Fancy? if the former I'd need to factor in sonar so together we have asw self defence; otherwise we have escorts to provide asw. And Fancy offers anti-ship capability.
Depends on how long you intend them to remain in service and when the Fancy and Bidder torpedoes would have entered service and of course how much money you're willing to put into it.Personally I would ditch the straight runners and use the extra volume and weight to further upgrade the ships electronics and AA. If you insist on retaining torpedoes and have the money to carry out the rather extensive refit needed, I'd go with the Sonar + Bidder combo. The 6"ers should be quite capable of taking care of any ASuW needs you might have. |
Author: | Portsmouth Bill [ May 19th, 2011, 11:38 am ] |
Post subject: | Re: The Alternative Postwar Royal Navy |
Thanks chaps. And re the liferafts; sure they stayed in service for a long time after WWII, but I put that down to M.O.D. parsimony; but I decided (as god) to allow full inflatables on the warships I'm doing, that served from around 1950'ish And re the alternative torpedoes; I wasn't that struck myself on retaining the old set, though again, they show up on photo's until these ship were retired - well into the 1950's. On balance I reckon Theil is right, the main guns still had a decent director, so could stand up well against another cruiser. So I might try Bidder with sonar, for fully independent operation, as was required sometimes. |
Author: | Hood [ May 22nd, 2011, 9:43 am ] |
Post subject: | Re: The Alternative Postwar Royal Navy |
HMS Liverpool was given a slightly different modernisation. She had a new enclosed bridge, and had an extra Mk 6 director aft but overall was very similar. Her tripod masts were cut down but retained. Liverpool had a short life as refitted and spent most of her last few years in reserve as the Tigers neared completion. The torpedo tubes were retained for conventional torpedoes. ![]() |
Author: | rifleman [ May 22nd, 2011, 11:42 am ] |
Post subject: | Re: The Alternative Postwar Royal Navy |
nice Wonder what other modifications Belfast would have had in this Au |
Author: | Portsmouth Bill [ May 22nd, 2011, 2:26 pm ] |
Post subject: | Re: The Alternative Postwar Royal Navy |
I'm presently working on the post WWII modernised Belfast (as well as the rebuilt 1943); but there are references to a more radical modernisation involving (among other things) straight funnels. I will do this version as best as I can for this AU; I think at present we are looking at of an all-gun variant, though she had the capability to ship Seaslug aft in lieu of guns. ![]() |
Author: | rifleman [ May 22nd, 2011, 3:02 pm ] |
Post subject: | Re: The Alternative Postwar Royal Navy |
My thoughts would her returning to Harlands for refit and as par becoming one of the first ships fitted with Sea Cat |
Author: | klagldsf [ May 22nd, 2011, 4:27 pm ] |
Post subject: | Re: The Alternative Postwar Royal Navy |
Were the hangars retained? Could they be used for boat storage? |
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