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Dante Alighieri: Italy's First Dreadnought
http://67.205.157.234/forums/viewtopic.php?f=12&t=9829		 Page 1 of 2
Author:  Karle94 [ April 8th, 2020, 5:00 pm ]
Post subject:  Dante Alighieri: Italy's First Dreadnought
The Dante Alighieri was the first dreadnought built by Italy. She was armed with 12x12in guns in four triple turrets in an unusual layout of one turret fore, one aft and two amidships, all on the centerline. Italy was the second nation to utilize triple turrets after Austria-Hungary. The ship had a seconday battery of 12x4,7in guns in casemates, and 4 twin turrets with 4,7in guns. The tertiary battery consisted of 13x76mm guns. The Dante Alighieri had three underwater tubes, two on the broadsides and one mounted in a prominent "ram" type bow. Top speed was 22kts. The Alighieri had the typical "Mediterranean" armor belt of around 10 inches. The ship was commisioned in 1913, and served as the flagship during WWI. Like the rest of the battleship of the Regia Marina, her wartime career was uneventful, spending most of her time either in port, or at sea bottling up the Austrio-Hungarian navy.

Dante Alighieri as commisioned in 1913:
[ img ]

Dante Alighieri as she appeared in 1915:
[ img ]

Dante Alighieri as she appeared in 1923:
[ img ]

Dante Alighieri as she appeared in 1925:
[ img ]
Author:  emperor_andreas [ April 8th, 2020, 7:34 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Dante Alighieri: Italy's First Dreadnought
Very nice work!
Author:  acelanceloet [ April 8th, 2020, 8:35 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Dante Alighieri: Italy's First Dreadnought
Are you sure that hull shading is correct? it looks as if you have a transom stern in front of your rudder, and the skegs for the propellers have the same shape on the connection point with the hull but the hull is near vertical on the inner shafts according to your shading, so it can't be the same shape of connection? Either your shaft entry points are completely wrong, or your hull shading is. The shading also suggests an extremely blocky midship section, which I doubt is accurate.

Speaking of shading, what on earth is that shading on the funnels, barbettes and secondary gun turrets? You have a shape somewhat like this if I interpret it correctly:
[ img ]
Aren't those surfaces supposed to be round? I could understand a single highlight being used as is sometimes seen, but this looks like wallpaper with bubbles behind it.

Your first 'deck line' above the waterline is also something I cannot find on pictures (https://i.imgur.com/IqYqoRN.jpg) I can also not find the name of the ship written there on that picture, the stern gallery looks quite different, The boat looks to be further aft, the companionway is missing, the conning tower looks different, as do the searchlight platforms, and the interesting shape of the turrets seems to be far less interesting on your drawing. The armour belt shape is also not something I can find back on the pictures.......

Might I recommend a comparision with some pictures of the ship? I suspect your reference artwork was not entirely correct, it should be possible to fix this and make it an excellent drawing, but it will take some work.
Author:  Karle94 [ April 8th, 2020, 9:03 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Dante Alighieri: Italy's First Dreadnought
I only have a few usable images of the ship. As for the rounding shades, that is how most drawings nowadays have them. If the companionway is what I think it is, don't we omit those? Are you refering to the secondary turrets, or the main turrets?
Author:  acelanceloet [ April 8th, 2020, 9:19 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Dante Alighieri: Italy's First Dreadnought
Even with a few images, I personally looked at only 2 just now, and that made me find the issues I listed.

I have never heard of companionways being omitted, I mean they are fixed on board the ship? I mean you also don't have the liferafts but those could be moved by hand, the companionways can only be removed by cranes and shipyards so I guess we should draw them?

I was talking about the main turrets. They are very rounded on the image I linked, both the top and the side, but on your drawing they have hard angles everywhere?

As for the rounding shades, I have never seen that kind of shading before. Yes, with a single highlight, showing it is circular and not octangular, and some people use that, but I don't see a 'darklight' on any drawing? Or at least I have never seen them and I cannot find them on any drawing but yours....
Author:  erik_t [ April 8th, 2020, 11:08 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Dante Alighieri: Italy's First Dreadnought
I think Gollevainen used shading like that once upon a time. I don't think it's common in modern (say, post-2015) use.

Aside from shading questions, a nice drawing!
Author:  Karle94 [ April 8th, 2020, 11:19 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Dante Alighieri: Italy's First Dreadnought
I've seen Garlic use that on rounded surfaces, with the back roundings being more similar to the old style.
Author:  acelanceloet [ April 9th, 2020, 6:03 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Dante Alighieri: Italy's First Dreadnought
That is exactly the point! Showing a rounded shape with light pixels front, dark pixels back, and a highlight in between is perfectly sensible. The dark pixels you have, symmetrical with the highlight, make no sense to me though and give the wrong impression to me, at the very least not of something circular.
Author:  Garlicdesign [ April 9th, 2020, 9:26 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Dante Alighieri: Italy's First Dreadnought
Hi all!

my two cents (on an otherwise well-executed drawing):

What ace means About shading: the darker colour at the rear end of the funnel (and the aft casemates, and the secondary turrets) should go all the way to the black outline. That's how I colour vertical circular structures. Shouldn't be much of a problem to remedy.

Bridge looks OK to me, but i think the upper level was not present when the ship was commissioned, but retrofitted later; that conflicts with the date 1913.

Italian WWI-era 305mm turrets are indeed rounded forward.

Pre-war, Italian ships were painted in a darker hue. Check the Amalfi-class armoured cruisers for an approximation (best guess by me based on photographs).

Placement and shape of shafts corresponds with all drawings of her that I know. I've not found any photograph of her in dock, but I bet Colombamike has a wallpaper-sized one. Can't comment on the lower hull shape, though I have to agree it does look wrong.

And companionways are not regularly omitted. I only keep forgetting them all the time...

Greetings
GD
Author:  Karle94 [ April 9th, 2020, 11:23 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Dante Alighieri: Italy's First Dreadnought
So I have fixed the issues mentioned above. The ship is repainted in an extreme blue-gray, the companionways are shown in a retracted position. I added shading to show the shape of the platforms round the rear smokestacks. I have redone the hull shading and findagled a bit with the propeller placemants, and modified all rounded shadings, including adding it to the turret fronts.
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